#indiewebcamp 2016-02-22

2016-02-22 UTC
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[kevinmarks] I think if you say seamless the CSS gets in
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[kevinmarks] My iframe trick is at pageaspreview.herokuapp.com and also my hovercards do it 8f they can't find microformats
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KartikPrabhu also preventing other sites from iframing your site is considered a good security practice
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[kevinmarks] Which has the ironic side effect of them being better designed than mine in many cases
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Schnitz how many of you people have actually digged into this? https://developers.facebook.com/docs/sharing/best-practices
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@INC_says Check out our #facebook page, Independent Network Channel - INC #roku #rokuUK #indie #indiefilm #indieweb & more https://www.facebook.com/INCnetwork (twitter.com/_/status/701576582188535808)
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Loqi [indieweb] "Check out our page, Independent Network Channel - INC & more" https://twitter.com/INC_says/status/701576582188535808
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KartikPrabhu the INC_says stuff is always talking about some other "indieweb"
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aaronpk !block @INC_says
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Loqi Got it! There are now 47 spammers blacklisted
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gRegorLove I should have a working PR for https://github.com/indieweb/php-mf2/issues/69 soon.
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Schnitz oh got it... styled POSSE, managed to get 4 silos iframed, javascripted, embedded, whatever into a normal web page http://www.schamonimusik.com/
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Schnitz dizzy from reading silo developers pages
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aaronpk gRegorLove++
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Loqi gRegorLove has 51 karma
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Schnitz styled PESOS of course, sorry
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gRegorLove Hm, maybe. Sometimes following the logic in php-mf2 is tricky. Need to be careful not to break other tests.
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gRegorLove Parsing questions in #microformats: http://logs.glob.uno/?c=freenode%23microformats&s=22+Feb+2016&e=22+Feb+2016#c85790
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aaronpk is making progress on turning p3k into something easily installable and configurable https://aaronparecki.com/uploads/Screen-Shot-2016-02-21-19-00-41.png
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gRegorLove Ooh, nice
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miklb aaronpk: I'd be interested in that. Not 100% sold on jekyll for my itches to scratch
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aaronpk oh yeah?
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miklb absolutely. What language is it written in?
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aaronpk interested in helping out with it or just using it?
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aaronpk it's PHP
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miklb both.
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aaronpk it's a Laravel project if you're familiar with that framework
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miklb I'm not beyond reading about it.
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aaronpk I wasn't either before I started :)
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miklb but all my other blogging was PHP, so not unfamiliar language
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aaronpk cool, that'd be fun
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aaronpk I'm still working on a bit of the bootstrapping part, but then I'm going to put it on github
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miklb I'll keep my eyes out. I have a VPS just sitting idle at the moment.
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miklb it's already set up for nginx/php-fpm just need to turn php back on
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aaronpk cool. yeah I run it under nginx, it has a couple of rewrite rules it needs but other than that it's straightforward
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miklb what database are you using?
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aaronpk mysql, and uses redis for caching and queuing
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miklb I'd have to set those up, previous blog engine was DB agnostic, so was using sqlite
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aaronpk in theory it could use mysql for the queue too, but i haven't tried that yet
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aaronpk i think i'm also not using anything mysql specific but i would have to double check. but then it could use sqlite or postgres easily
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aaronpk probably worth looking into that sooner than later
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aaronpk wish i could make this a little easier: https://aaronparecki.com/uploads/Screen-Shot-2016-02-21-20-48-41.png
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KartikPrabhu aaronpk: do you know about Google's image proxy?
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aaronpk yeah. this is way more than a proxy
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KartikPrabhu oh ok
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KartikPrabhu if it does more things it will be more complex
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aaronpk https://github.com/aaronpk/ca3db
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aaronpk it stores the avatars so that I never end up with broken image links when people change their images
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KartikPrabhu the google proxy will also cache images for a while
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aaronpk i definitely want more than a "while"
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KartikPrabhu yeah that if different then :)
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KartikPrabhu s/if.is
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KartikPrabhu belh
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aaronpk if you look back at my posts from 2014 or even a lot of 2015, you'll see a whole bunch of missing images on the likes and comments
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KartikPrabhu i have that problem too so I understand
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aaronpk i actually launched this on webmention.io so now all the webmentions it sends have avatar URLs that won't die :)
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KartikPrabhu neat
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aaronpk s/sends/receives
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Loqi aaronpk meant to say: i actually launched this on webmention.io so now all the webmentions it receives have avatar URLs that won't die :)
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cjk101010 morning
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sknebel morning :)
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gRegorLove !tell aaronpk PR for php-mf2 issue 69 if you'd like to try it out: https://github.com/indieweb/php-mf2/pull/82
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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[kevinmarks] https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/701671100078403584
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@kevinmarks Mark Zuckerberg announces the successful launch of the “Blue Pill” movement 💊 😎 [photo] (twitter.com/_/status/701671100078403584)
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@pvagner RT @kevinmarks #indieweb @rrrrrrrix: I connect the matrix chat system to the indieweb here http://whatthefuck.computer/blog/2015/12/19/matrix-and-indieweb/ (twitter.com/_/status/701683078394212352)
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@d0gada @benwerd Please write more about withKnown. At least until #IndieWeb will appear in Twitter's hashtag auto-competition list. (twitter.com/_/status/701683348511526912)
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@jkphl @LukasRosenstock Happy to have you on board for the #IndieWebCamp here in Nuremberg! \o/ :) (twitter.com/_/status/701690763659317248)
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Loqi [indieweb] "IndieWeb and Hypocricy" http://starseerdrgn.dreamwidth.org/5777.html
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Loqi [indieweb] "IndieWeb and Hypocricy" https://starseerdrgn.dreamwidth.org/5777.html
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KartikPrabhu aaronpk: might want to reply to that ^
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michel_v something to be said about obtaining someone's identity for everything more easily when they host it on their own server
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michel_v not everyone can secure their server as good as Google or Facebook
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Phyks hmm, do you know guys if #microformats is the place to ask about mf2 implementations?
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petermolnar michel_v but the chances of locking yourself out of your server is less than google or fb blocking your for some previously nonexistent terms&conditions
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petermolnar !tell snarfed thank you very much for brid.gy #619 fix
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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petermolnar snarfed++
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Loqi snarfed has 201 karma
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@grantpotter #indieweb #openweb "Give people more reasons to promote diversity on the web, not just in who we read, but who .. http://known.networkeffects.ca/2016/indieweb-openweb-give-people-more-reasons-to-promote-diversity-on (twitter.com/_/status/701768151860715521)
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Loqi [indieweb] "#indieweb #openweb "Give people more reasons to promote diversity on the web, not just in who we read, but who controls what we read." http://scripting.com/liveblog/users/davewiner/2016/01/20/0900.html" by Grant Potter http://known.networkeffects.ca/2016/indieweb-openweb-give-people-more-reasons-to-promote-diversity-on
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[jgarber] Morning, ‘campers!
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Loqi [jgarber]: tantek left you a message 19 hours, 32 minutes ago: hey time for you to edit and upgrade HWC DC to "Regular Meetings" from "Up and coming" - https://indiewebcamp.com/Homebrew_Website_Club#Meetings ! :) http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-02-21/line/1456079812903
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sixtwothree.org edited /Homebrew_Website_Club (+53) "Move Washington, DC to list of Regular Meetings" (view diff)
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[oliverpattison] hey jgarber – added that second RSVP
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[jgarber] !tell tantek Done!
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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[jgarber] oliverpattison: Thanks!
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aaronpk good morning
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Loqi aaronpk: gRegorLove left you a message 8 hours, 40 minutes ago: PR for php-mf2 issue 69 if you'd like to try it out: https://github.com/indieweb/php-mf2/pull/82 http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-02-21/line/1456124790675
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aaronpk well this is promising: https://twitter.com/DropshareForMac/status/701690450957230084
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@DropshareForMac @aaronpk once the RFC is passed, we’ll gladly look into it. (twitter.com/_/status/701690450957230084)
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aaronparecki.com edited /web-sign-in-protocol (+90) "/* Discovery */" (view diff)
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aaronparecki.com edited /web-sign-in-protocol (+67) "/* Examples */" (view diff)
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@olivermakes This Wednesday at 5:30: #indieweb Homebrew Website Club in DC. https://indiewebcamp.com/next-hwc https://twitter.com/jgarber/status/700683931222458368 (twitter.com/_/status/701802450307543041)
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Loqi [mention] someone wrote a post that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/ https://webmention.io/notification/A-1vkGKcX9KBdkCfe1xz1g
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raucao aaronpk: ownyourgram doesn't auto-post my pics. added a comment to https://github.com/aaronpk/OwnYourGram/issues/24 as i also get a 404 on the profile page. might be related
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@ReadersGazette BLOG Indie Author Answers by Jim Heskett http://www.jimheskett.com/indieauth Get help writing your book #bookbloggers 83 (twitter.com/_/status/701811192285757442)
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@jkphl @opexxx Wenn ich mir deine Twitter-Bio so ansehe: Wäre nicht unser @indiewebcamp während der @nueww was für dich? http://indiewebcamp.com/2016/Nuremberg (twitter.com/_/status/701814197290725377)
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aaronpk raucao: yeah this has been happening for a while, I unfortunately have no explanation for what's wrong
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aaronpk instagram just isn't sending the callback for some people
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aaronpk and there's no pattern from what i can tell
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KartikPrabhu aaronpk: privacy setings?
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aaronpk nope
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aaronpk and re-authorizing doesn't seem to help
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aaronpk and the api still says the subscription is active
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KartikPrabhu weird
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KartikPrabhu snowflakeapi--
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Loqi snowflakeapi has -1 karma
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aaronpk yeah, and i'm kind of wondering if they're going to drop that endpoint altogether as part of the upcoming changes
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raucao oh, ok
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raucao can you poll maybe?
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aaronpk i can for now, but that actually adds a lot of complexity, and i'm not convinced i'm going to survive the api client slaughter in june
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raucao ooh, what slaughter?
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tantek what is the Instagram API problem?
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Loqi tantek: [jgarber] left you a message 2 hours, 48 minutes ago: Done! http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-02-22/line/1456150772005
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Instagram API problem" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10Eq
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tantek good morning #indiewebcamp!
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aaronpk http://indiewebcamp.com/Instagram#Permissions_approval
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tantek Instagram API problem is /Instagram#Permissions_approval
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loqi.me created /Instagram_API_problem (+43) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-02-22/line/1456160899581 and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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KartikPrabhu wonders if this http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-02-22#t1456131763854 shows that the IndieAuth documentation needs to be improved
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aaronpk KartikPrabhu: yeah and it depends on what your entry point is too
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aaronpk it looks like that person found the "web sign-in" page first
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tantek what is Hypocricy?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Hypocricy" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10Er
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KartikPrabhu typo man!
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aaronpk raucao: there are too many users for me to do a trivial polling of everyone's accounts, so i'd have to implement something like checking frequent posters more often, and reduce the frequency for people who post less often. all of that sounds like a non-trivial amount of work and I don't want to go that route unless i'm reasonably sure this whole thing won't get shut down in june
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raucao sure, i understand
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KartikPrabhu aaronpk: on a positive note, you could write a long op-ed about why you shutdown and how you are very sad ;)
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aaronpk lol
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tantek KartikPrabhu: it was a reference to the article name
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KartikPrabhu tantek: yeah, i am sure it is a typo in the title entry
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KartikPrabhu the body has correct spelling iitc
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KartikPrabhu s/iitc/iirc
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Loqi KartikPrabhu meant to say: the body has correct spelling iirc
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raucao OUCH -> "Ryan Barrett applied for basic permissions for Bridgy and oauth-dropins in Jan 2016. Both were rejected."
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raucao i only remembered everyone being so happy with instagram for posting photos to their site, but i guess that was just a matter of time
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tantek raucao: they still have a well designed UX, that's not in dispute
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raucao if i can't get my own data out, then it is
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tantek and they post-process videos into a cross-browser/device compatible .mp4
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raucao that's part of ux for me
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tantek raucao++ good point :)
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Loqi raucao has 2 karma
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KartikPrabhu depends on what you mean by "get own data out"
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KartikPrabhu they have an export functionality?
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raucao i mean constantly
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KartikPrabhu PESOS is a much finer degree of control that they might not be comfortable with
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KartikPrabhu content going out of their silo etc...
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tantek raucao indeed. right now I manually do it one post at a time from IG. Not the ideal solution.
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raucao i guess they won't shut down zapier, so maybe i'll try to use that somehow
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raucao btw, would be awesome to have micropub as an action in zapier. did anyone ever ask?
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raucao also, one could still scrape the website of course (ugh, the horror). at least given they don't block IPs from what looks like robot agents
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tantek jgarber++ for launching HWC DC this year!
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Loqi jgarber has 5 karma
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tantek hey raucao - you should add yourself to /irc-people so you're linked and avatared in the logs!
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tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-02-22/line/1456161548874
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Loqi [raucao] also, one could still scrape the website of course (ugh, the horror). at least given they don't block IPs from what looks like robot agents
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aaronpk raucao: you can effectively do micropub in zapier and ifttt because you can use their http post methods
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raucao i thought iftt doesn't have a post method?
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raucao did i miss it?
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aaronpk it's called the "maker" channel
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raucao oh god
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aaronpk lol
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raucao i saw that in the results and it so doesn't look like a custom post integration
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raucao with logo and all
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raucao jeez
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aaronpk i'm using it to post my withings weight to my site!
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raucao cool
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raucao how do i get a token?
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raucao or whatever i need to auth
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aaronpk you'll need a micropub endpoint and a token endpoint
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aaronpk http://indiewebcamp.com/micropub-endpoint
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raucao i do have ownyourgram connected in theory. but is there an easy way to just copy its request so i don't have to read specs and jump through hoops for iftt integration?
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aaronpk sure, the dashboard page in ownyourgram tells you pretty much what it's going to send
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aaronpk tho I don't think it shows you the token it has for you
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tantek.com edited /p3k_naming_convention (+18) "/* Unused Names */ Townhall for the inevitable wiki feature ;)" (view diff)
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aaronpk what's powering your site?
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raucao known
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raucao maybe i can find it in the db
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aaronpk hm yeah. i don't know how Known keeps track of issued tokens, but kylewm would know
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raucao lol, it's setting a cookie in responses to micropub requests :)
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aaronpk lol um, that probably shouldn't happen
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Loqi [mention] Oliver Pattison wrote a post that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/next-hwc https://webmention.io/notification/k22ctqKlKItpPPNbs0B8wA
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Loqi [mention] Chris Heuer, Tomas Puig, Christopher Wilson, Irene Gerritse, Sabrina Bruning, and Arun Ranganathan were invited to an event: "Homebrew Website Club Meetup" https://indiewebcamp.com/events/2016-02-24-homebrew-website-club and https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-02-22 https://webmention.io/notification/Z5DEOXawxYXCx3jxhYdQaw
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Loqi [mention] Chris Heuer, Tomas Puig, Christopher Wilson, Irene Gerritse, Sabrina Bruning, and Arun Ranganathan were invited to https://webmention.io/notification/2D4LkkuMNCYe8T30IpcUlA
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tantek interesting dupe
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tantek of clusters!
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aaronpk one links to the event, the other links to IRC logs
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aaronpk notification text is hard
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gregorlove.com created /Mozilla_Developer_Network (+139) "stub" (view diff)
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loqi.me created /MDN (+60) "prompted by gRegorLove and dfn added by gRegorLove" (view diff)
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sebastian.kip.pe edited /IRC_People (+136) "Add raucao" (view diff)
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sebastian.kip.pe edited /IRC_People (-1) (view diff)
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raucao oops
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[kevinmarks] Aaron, you can call the ownyourgram.com replacement "pantograph"
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tantek graph might be too close to gram
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aaronpk snarfed: how did these two URLs get into this instagram "like"? https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/instagram/aaronpk/1185199334578047205_1500881/1185334799876606173
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Loqi [Kevin 魏夏凯] 😀
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aaronpk it's sending backfeed to a totally wrong post
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aaronpk check out the two in-reply-to URLs http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fbrid-gy.appspot.com%2Fcomment%2Finstagram%2Faaronpk%2F1185199334578047205_1500881%2F1185334799876606173
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snarfed aaronpk: looks like bridgy found a syndication url from https://aaronparecki.com/2016/02/14/12/ to http://instagram.com/p/BByrIPtjcjl/ 2016-02-14 7:42 PM PST
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Loqi snarfed: petermolnar left you a message 6 hours, 34 minutes ago: thank you very much for brid.gy #619 fix http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-02-22/line/1456142412576
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Loqi [Aaron Parecki] TIL #alexa will respond to YouTube videos of #alexa almost exactly in sync. #amazonecho #internetofshit
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aaronpk snarfed: yeah that's the correct one. but it's also finding another URL somehow
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snarfed yeah
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snarfed not sure yet
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aaronpk the good news is my comment update handling is working, since it moved all the comments to the other post
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aaronpk OH i figured it out... my home page is wrong
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snarfed ?
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snarfed oh the synd url there?
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snarfed aha
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snarfed glad you found it
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tantek ok HWC cities, are we confirme for this week?
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tantek where is HWC?
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tantek when is HWC?
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Loqi https://indiewebcamp.com/hwc
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snarfed btw aaronpk re not polling in ownyourgram...it only has 80 users, right? that's not too many to poll. bridgy does it with ~50x that :P
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snarfed you could poll as infrequently as every 4h or 1d or so. shouldn't be prohibitive
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tantek oh snap
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tantek (no chat)
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snarfed (also example code for scraping IG's html: https://github.com/snarfed/granary/blob/master/granary/instagram.py#L571 )
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aaronpk snarfed: 300+ users :(
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aaronpk part of the problem is I want the photos to be imported more often than every 4 hours. the realtime aspect of the IG API is really nice
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Loqi gives aaronpk the photos to be imported more often than every
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tantek wow Twitter follower requests are depressing
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tantek nearly all obvious spam or egg-icons
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tantek alright, last call for Brighton (adactio), Göteborg, Los Angeles HWC this week for announcing to Moz!
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tantek Jeena
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tantek https://twitter.com/follower_requests needs a block button next to each account (beyond [Accept] [Decline] )
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Loqi [indieweb] "WeeklyUpdates/2016-02-22" by Tantek https://wiki.mozilla.org/index.php?title=WeeklyUpdates/2016-02-22&diff=1118095&oldid=1118082
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tantek nice. that was fast
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tantek also re: https://twitter.com/follower_requests - would be useful to know if any of my followings/followers are already following them
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KevinMarks that url only resolves on a private account
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aaronpk oh hey dropshare liked my post about micropub
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aaronpk so maybe more a misunderstanding of the w3c process than just a dismissal
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tantek maybe they typo'd RFC / REC?
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tantek (just realized those are only one letter / ASCII point off
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snarfed aaronpk: ah. i guess "82 users" on http://ownyourgram.com/ is out of date
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aaronpk checks
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snarfed might still be nice to poll everyone occasionally as a backup...but i know you've put more thought into this than me
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snarfed not a big deal
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aaronpk aha. 82 people have actually connected instagram. 379 have attempted to sign in
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aaronpk yeah i wonder if making it poll everyone once a day would be a good enough intermediate solution
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tantek if anyone is curious about Mozilla weekly meetings, tune your browser to https://air.mozilla.com/
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tantek about to start today's
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tantek (the HWC announcement is near the beginning)
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tantek aside: now that I have private silo accounts I'm feeling more compelled to actually write silo-specific bios so people have some idea what I post about before requesting to follow
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tantek.com edited /MediaWiki:Sidebar (-41) "PDX SF DC" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Main_Page (+42) "/* Homebrew Website Club */ update cities" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Events (+56) "/* February */ DC" (view diff)
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gRegorLove tantek: https://air.mozilla.com/ not found
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tantek darn it, .org
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tantek goes to file a bugzilla redirect ticket
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aaronpk ha that's one way to solve that
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gRegorLove "Error loading player: No playable sources found" Is it already over?
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tantek no it's still on
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tantek talking about encryption
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gRegorLove Huh. That's the message I get in Firefox 44.
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gRegorLove breaks stuff for tantek for a change
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GWG Afternoon
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@superfeedr A pretty cool use case for our #tracker accounts by @aaronpk https://aaronparecki.com/2016/02/20/5/global-webmentions #webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/701859726464851968)
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GWG Everybody Loves aaronpk.
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@aaronpk RT @superfeedr A pretty cool use case for our #tracker accounts by @aaronpk https://aaronparecki.com/2016/02/20/5/global-webmentions #webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/701860100252643329)
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tantek apparently Instagram has a 150 char bio limit
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@myfreeweb RT @superfeedr A pretty cool use case for our #tracker accounts by @aaronpk https://aaronparecki.com/2016/02/20/5/global-webmentions #webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/701862064172748802)
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Loqi [mention] superfeedr wrote a post that linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/micropub https://webmention.io/notification/4xyd5Rkhph4nKVggQezr5w
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tantek.com edited /Instagram (+258) "/* Features */ profile, icon, name, 150 char bio, website, who to follow when you follow" (view diff)
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aaronpk hmm
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aaronpk snarfed: when you blacklisted the URLs on my account, was that only when sending webmentions? cause I still see the URLs on the bridgy permalinks like https://brid-gy.appspot.com/post/twitter/aaronpk/701860100252643329
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Loqi [superfeedr] A pretty cool use case for our #tracker accounts by @aaronpk buff.ly/1KA5kF0 #webmentions
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snarfed aaronpk: yes, just for sending
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aaronpk ah okay. i'm still running my twitter search script which uses the bridgy permalinks so some are still leaking through
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snarfed oh also i need to blacklist indiewebcamp.com/micropub too evidently
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snarfed since that's the redirect leaf
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aaronpk hm no wait, my script only sends a webmention to my endpoint
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aaronpk actually wait what... micropub.net doesn't redirect anymore
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snarfed ah then good
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snarfed oh right, bridgy resolves bio redirect urls at signup time, not on every mention
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snarfed so you'll probably want to reauth with twitter
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aaronpk aha
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snarfed aww https://brid.gy/twitter/aaronpk looks so lonely now :P
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aaronpk oh it's gone from the permalinks now too! yay!
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Loqi :D
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Loqi [indieweb] "Having fun with #Telegram bots" by Rick Mendes http://www.rmendes.net/2016/having-fun-with-telegram-bots-exploring-slackbots-abilities
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jonnybarnes anyone heard of Google Jibe? http://jibe.google.com
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jonnybarnes I can’t work out exactly what it is
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jonnybarnes it seems to be an RCS client, but what is RCS?
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snarfed aha, announced just now at mwc
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snarfed looks like the successor to SMS, not an end user app
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aaronpk wow crazy
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[kevinmarks] Weird name, sounds like a platform for trolling
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snarfed looks like just the friendly name for the RCS protocol, like Jabber for XMPP
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aaronpk ah it was a company acquired by google
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aaronpk https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/jibe-mobile
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tantek Jibe / Jabber - not confusing at all ;)
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[kevinmarks] Does Jibe not mean insult in America?
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[kevinmarks] That reminds me, they're trying to replace "queet" with "quip"
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snarfed honestly my first thought was sailing
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snarfed https://www.google.com/search?q=define%3Ajibe "change course by swinging a fore-and-aft sail across a following wind."
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bear "does that jibe with what your thinking"
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snarfed yup that to
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aaronpk i thought that was "jive"
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bear jibe is more prevalent if you are aware of what the sailing version of jibe is
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bear (trying to say... I think "does that jibe..." is said instead of "does that jive..." if you come from a place where "prepare to jibe" is used
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[kevinmarks] Because you need to duck under the mast when jibing?
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[kevinmarks] So it's like a pivot, but if you're not ready you get knocked out of the boat?
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tantek sailing is "jib" pretty sure.
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snarfed different words :P
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snarfed https://www.google.com/search?q=define%3Ajib "a triangular staysail set forward of the forwardmost mast."
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bear one of the phrases that gets my attention immediately ... "prepare to come about!"
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[zero-gravitas] Could anyone point me to a webmention endpoint I could use for testing?
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aaronpk [zero-gravitas]: there are some links here http://indiewebcamp.com/webmention-implementation-guide
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aaronpk this is probably what you want https://github.com/pfefferle/node-webmention-testendpoint
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[zero-gravitas] aaronpk: perfect, thanks
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snarfed hey aaronpk, low priority feature request, consider filling out your author h-card on https://aaronparecki.com/articles and /notes? :P
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Loqi [Aaron Parecki] Enabling Global Webmentions with Telegraph and Superfeedr
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snarfed right now it only has url
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[aaronpk] "Filling out"?
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[aaronpk] There's a full h-card at the bottom, and authorship discovery finds it
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snarfed ah ok. is this the last recent rule in that algorithm you mentioned?
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[aaronpk] Oh actually you mean on the feed page not on the individual posts?
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snarfed yes
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snarfed looking at eg http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=https://aaronparecki.com/articles
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[aaronpk] Hm authorship discovery doesn't apply there since there is no entry in question. That's an own issue on XRay too
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[aaronpk] It will likely be something similar to the existing algorithm
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snarfed representative h-card?
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tantek what's the problem being solved?
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[aaronpk] I'm now case 7 on that
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[aaronpk] Finding the author of an h-feed
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snarfed right
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snarfed end user use case: you're building a reader, and you're rendering feeds, and you want to show info about each feed, eg author name/url/picture
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snarfed (this is where i back slowly away and defer to smarter people like you two, kylewm who'd implement it in mf2util, etc)
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tantek perhaps start by documenting how authors are marked up on existing /h-feed#IndieWeb_Examples ?
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KevinMarks in hatom we required authot at feed level http://microformats.org/wiki/hatom
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tantek format "requirements" rarely (if ever?) work out well
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tantek we only required it, because Atom required it. we ended up just propagating their mistake.
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tantek this is a common mistake in formats (still)
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tantek not everyone has learned that particular HTML5 lesson
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KevinMarks right, but h-feed says p-author h-card
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tantek but it doesn't say required
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KevinMarks sure
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tantek all properties are always optional. if you do use it, here's how to.
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KevinMarks so seeing if people do it is worthwhile
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tantek hence my previous recommendation
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KevinMarks atom specifcally said feed proeprties applied to entries, but entry coudl override
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tantek which was also a bit of a mess
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tantek so much special-casing
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tantek hence: https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-02-22/line/1456177426893
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Loqi [tantek] perhaps start by documenting how authors are marked up on existing /h-feed#IndieWeb_Examples ?
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snarfed http://microformats.org/ is down :(
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KevinMarks it was up for me a few minutes ago, though a bit unresponsive
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snarfed "Fatal error: Out of memory (allocated 27787264)"
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tantek drat
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tantek Fatal error: Out of memory (allocated 20709376) (tried to allocate 122880 bytes) in /var/www/html/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/defensio-anti-spam/defensio_pluggable.php on line 63
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tantek sigh wordpress
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tantek snarfed, could you retry microformats.org?
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snarfed back up, thanks
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tantek note to those creating supposedly self/auto-updating open source. DO NOT require the user to "Please enter your FTP credentials to proceed. If you do not remember your credentials, you should contact your web host."
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tantek this is one of those things I dislike about WP
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aaronpk WP doesn't do that if it has write permissions to update the files itself
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aaronpk it's a reasonable fallback actually
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tantek FTP is not secure
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aaronpk presumably they mean SFTP?
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tantek the whole "write permissions to update the files itself" ought to be something to be fixed
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aaronpk it's a tough one though. either you give the software write permissions to itself, which then means attackers have a higher chance of getting their bad software onto the machine, or you make it take a manual step that the user has to do to update the software so that it can't be attacked that way
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tantek interesting
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snarfed ^ that
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snarfed ...and in the latter case, you're less secure because you get patches late or never
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snarfed in practice, many security people feel like auto update is the net win on that tradeoff
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snarfed (weasel wording, i know, but still)
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aaronpk it's true. ever since wordpress has streamlined the update process i've managed to keep it up to date way better
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snarfed ie, to oversimplify, if it's a choice between preventing privelege escalation and preventing them getting in at all, prefer the latter
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aaronpk now it's basically "hey there's an update! [click] ... done"
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snarfed and now not even click :P
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aaronpk wait what
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snarfed auto update! been around in WP for a while
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snarfed soon for plugins too
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snarfed difficult but important
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aaronpk i don't remember seeing that on mine
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aaronpk oh wow, it did update itself
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snarfed may still be opt in for existing installations
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gRegorLove Pretty sure WP 3.7+ has auto core update, unless you specifically set WP_AUTO_UPDATE_CORE to false, or 'minor'
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aaronpk nice
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gRegorLove 'minor' is the default actually, so point-releases and security fixes
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[kylewm] So if the e.g. www-data group has write permissions to the WordPress directory, it'll overwrite its own files without FTP?
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aaronpk yeah, has been like that for a long time
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gRegorLove Jibe acquired by Google. Should I add it to site-deaths ~2017? :)
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