#indiewebcamp 2015-09-05

2015-09-05 UTC
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kevinmarks.com edited /follow (+651) "/* Follow Webaction */" (view diff)
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KevinMarks I added a bit, including a woodwind bookmarklet
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tantek ooh very cool!
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@cjk101010 This IndieWeb stuff is pretty interesting. I'm somewhat satisfied what I achieved in just 1,5 days of work. Next… (http://wwwtech.de/notes/7) (twitter.com/_/status/639960527402176512)
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Loqi [mention] Caleb Queern liked a post that linked to a photo: "Content-Security-Policy" https://indiewebcamp.com/Content-Security-Policy https://webmention.io/notification/Jbn3aIvoVRFqi07wT7mjOw
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tantek hmm - I'm liking the parenthetical permashortlink presentation - does help to communicate that you're not just mentioning a link: https://twitter.com/cjk101010/status/639960527402176512
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@cjk101010 This IndieWeb stuff is pretty interesting. I'm somewhat satisfied what I achieved in just 1,5 days of work. Next… (http://wwwtech.de/notes/7) (twitter.com/_/status/639960527402176512)
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tantek sure it costs 2 more characters, but perhaps that's worth it for the understanding gained
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tantek "1,5" likely means "one and half"
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KartikPrabhu german convention
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wagle whats the easiest api to interact with twitter?
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kylewm wagle: what language?
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wagle agnostic.. first guess was python, but others are fine
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kylewm someone brought up https://github.com/sferik/t in #knownchat the other day, that looked interesting
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GWG I need a swiss army knife of APIs
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kylewm tweepy and bear's twitter library are both good for python
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kylewm though, tbh i just use requests and request-oauthlib
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snarfed requests++
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Loqi requests has 1 karma
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snarfed wagle: alternatively feel free to use https://granary-demo.appspot.com/ if you'd rather consume twitter data as mf2 html/json (or atom or whatever) instead of its snowflake api
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wagle oh neat
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kylewm snarfed++ oh yeah, duh
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Loqi snarfed has 137 karma
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wagle thanks guys.. my brain just decided to shut down for the night though.. 8/
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kylewm same
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kylewm GWG: swiss army knife of apis would be a pretty good tag line for Granary, but it's off theme
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GWG kylewm: I just want to put my data in and have it come out the way I want on a bunch of sites...
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GWG I haven't gotten there
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GWG is trying to decide what is next
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tantek is going to wiki things until he falls asleep.
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tantek wonders if KevinMarks hovercard parses multiple u-urls from people's h-cards and e.g. shows icons for "other" (silo) profile URLs
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@danja @kevinmarks @t #indieweb appears to deprecate RSS/Atom for #microformats. Deployment stats for each? h-feed aggregator implementations? (twitter.com/_/status/640067518405713920)
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@kevinmarks @danja @t have a look at http://indiewebcamp.com/feed and http://indiewebcamp.com/reader (twitter.com/_/status/640068369622790144)
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@kevinmarks @danja @t if you have legacy feeds, there is a translator at unmung.con. Have you deprecated hyperdata.it? #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/640085129126219777)
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KevinMarks !tell tantek - examples and pull request for hovercards encouraged (your org list is a good test case)
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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@danja @kevinmarks unmung, cool - but what can you do with the results? Any aggregator implementations? hyperdata.it not yet built :) #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/640097316230307840)
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Loqi [bridgy] Danny Ayers replied '@kevinmarks ah, sorry - missed indiewebcamp.com/reader. I'm soon to revisit a feedreader, wondering whether it'll be worth adding h-feed' to a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/feed (https://twitter.com/danja/status/640098327468576768)
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Loqi [bridgy] Danny Ayers replied '@kevinmarks ah, sorry - missed indiewebcamp.com/reader. I'm soon to revisit a feedreader, wondering whether it'll be worth adding h-feed' to a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/reader (https://twitter.com/danja/status/640098327468576768)
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Loqi [bridgy] Danny Ayers replied '@kevinmarks @t my question with aggregator developer's hat on, would be - are there (m)any sites that provide h-feed but not Atom/RSS?' to a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/reader (https://twitter.com/danja/status/640099748448440320)
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Loqi [bridgy] Danny Ayers replied '@kevinmarks @t my question with aggregator developer's hat on, would be - are there (m)any sites that provide h-feed but not Atom/RSS?' to a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/feed (https://twitter.com/danja/status/640099748448440320)
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snarfed1 starts on https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/51#issuecomment-136792750
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tantek good morning #indiewebcamp!
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Loqi tantek: KevinMarks left you a message 5 hours, 24 minutes ago: - examples and pull request for hovercards encouraged (your org list is a good test case) http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-09-05/line/1441443482090
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aaronpk good morning!
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tantek KevinMarks: example is my own site! which already has "other profiles" marked up as additional u-url values of the top level / representative h-card :) http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=http://tantek.com/
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tantek now I suppose I should mock up a visual design for what "shows icons for "other" (silo) profile URLs" should/could look like inside hovercard ...
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tantek (or you could try hacking something up using one of those free social media icon sets)
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loqi.me created /social_media_icon_set (+259) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /social_media_icon_set (+288) "link to Paul's github for his icons, indieweb uses, see also" (view diff)
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voxpelli tantek: it can get pretty Nascar:ish, https://flattr.com/profile/timpritlove ;)
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tantek.com edited /hovercard (+626) "/* Brainstorming */ Icons to other profiles" (view diff)
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voxpelli had an experiment where I listed everyone's social graph profile on their Twitter cards – some Microformats enthusiasts posed a UI-challenge :)
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tantek voxpelli: that timpritlove example is quite different than what I intended, so I should call out the differences
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voxpelli tantek: you would get them all for the h-card of that page if I still had access to the Flattr page so I could mark up the rel-me:s as u-url
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voxpelli a fallback to rel-me for representative h-cards would be nice as well btw
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tantek.com edited /hovercard (+300) "/* Icons to other profiles */ a few more details to avoid NASCAR like effects" (view diff)
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tantek voxpelli: yes
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Loqi [bridgy] Kevin Marks replied '@danja @t if they provide h-feed, it's more likely to be full posts. Counting the microformats 1 version, quite a lot - WordPress by default' to a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/feed (https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/640172270862790656)
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Loqi [bridgy] Kevin Marks replied '@danja @t if they provide h-feed, it's more likely to be full posts. Counting the microformats 1 version, quite a lot - WordPress by default' to a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/reader (https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/640172270862790656)
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tantek.com edited /hovercard (+171) "/* Icons to other profiles */ add rel=me links as fallback as suggested by voxpelli" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /OwnYourGram (+7) "explicit TOC for easier section linking" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /OwnYourGram (+420) "features, propagate person-tags" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /OwnYourGram (+110) "IRC citations" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /person-tag (+741) "With other profiles example markup, so people can start publishing it, and services (Bridgy Publish) can start consuming" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /person-tag (+121) "/* With other profiles */ t, f should be social media icons" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /social_media_icon (+35) "r" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk: as someone who person-tags their photos, I'm curious what you think of this: https://indiewebcamp.com/person-tag#With_other_profiles
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aaronpk oh interesting
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tantek note that I included reasons why
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aaronpk the micropub version of that would require posting an h-card, not just a URL
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tantek not necessarily - your site could lookup the URL in your nicknames cache
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aaronpk yeah i'm thinking if I don't have it in the cache tho
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tantek or go do rel=me discovery itself
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aaronpk it could I suppose. certainly easier first step
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tantek and use that discovery to populate an entry in your nicknames cache for the future
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aaronpk hm I'd have to think about how that would look with my current person-tag display
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tantek right, hence the note about (t, f) and using social media icons
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tantek and why I wrote this up: https://indiewebcamp.com/hovercard#Icons_to_other_profiles
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tantek (equivalent problem)
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[kevinmarks] Or hovercard could do it later. The hovercard challenge is deciding how to winnow more detailed profiles - doing something like Facebook's "here are 2 things that you'll find interesting"
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[kevinmarks] I need to fix the multiple org better too
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kylewm ohh, interesting. i was able to person-tag someone via the facebook api without specifying a place/location
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kylewm https://www.facebook.com/kyle.mahan/posts/10101452975502369?pnref=story
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kylewm is it possible they actually added a feature instead of removing one!
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tantek awesome!!!
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tantek kylewm++
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Loqi kylewm has 232 karma
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tantek optimism++
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Loqi optimism has 1 karma
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snarfed kylewm: which api version!
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snarfed er ?
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kylewm 2.4
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snarfed yup, and that's the version the docs say can't
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snarfed funny
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tantek.com edited /person-tag (+7) "/* With other profiles */ explicit p-name" (view diff)
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kylewm snarfed: do you happen to have a link to that in the docs? i couldn't find it
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snarfed https://developers.facebook.com/docs/graph-api/reference/v2.4/user/feed#u_0_28
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kylewm thanks!
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kylewm.com edited /POSSE_to_Facebook (+182) "/* Mention Tagging */ update" (view diff)
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kylewm.com edited /POSSE_to_Facebook (+97) "/* Mention Tagging */" (view diff)
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KartikPrabhu tantek: re https://indiewebcamp.com/person-tag#With_other_profiles wouldn't use only icons for person-tags
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tantek is realizing every /response is a potential /webaction
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KartikPrabhu icons are fragile on loading and support etc... having text fallback is always better
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tantek KartikPrabhu: I think you misread. the icons are only for the social media other profile links
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tantek which, in that context are so secondary that it's ok that they're only minimal icons
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KartikPrabhu true. but if the icons don't load those links are unaccessible
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tantek nah - they can still have alt="Twitter profile" etc.
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tantek obv
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KartikPrabhu the links themselves will be invisible to the reader tough so alt does not help
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tantek I think you're confused about how images display if the src doesn't load
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tantek "will be invisible" is false
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KartikPrabhu oh! hmm yeah my bad, just woke up :P
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KartikPrabhu needs more coffee
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tantek has had zero coffee today so far
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tantek.com created /indie_post_discovery (+713) "stub with definition, thoughts from http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-09-01#t1441134821873" (view diff)
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KevinMarks you can use the favicon service google wrote for profiles
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KevinMarks http://s2.googleusercontent.com/s2/favicons?domain=tantek.com
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tantek.com edited /content_management_system (+2453) "capture the why re-use vs why build your own debate / points in http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-09-01" (view diff)
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tantek snarfed: captured our CMS use vs. make your own debate ^^^ please feel free to add / clean up wording :)
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snarfed thanks tantek! lgtm
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tantek there are many points to consider and no obvious answer for all cases - worth continuing to iterate on
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aaronpk very nice
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tantek it's been an unspoken debate for far too long - now it's got a start of documentation
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snarfed the intro paragraph might belong under "why write your own" instead of implying it's generally accepted, but i don't feel strongly
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snarfed otherwise lgtm!
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tantek snarfed: yeah - definitely feel free to fix accordingly!
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snarfed ok!
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aaronpk if you saw a header that says "this week" do you assume calendar week or past 7 days?
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tantek (it was definitely a hurried copy/paste job ;) )
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tantek or past 5 days? /me ducks
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+2424) "minimal photo posts supported since 2015-244, lots more photo post improvement to do, https embedded map images" (view diff)
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tantek postpones writing up /venue brainstorming thoughts starting at http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-09-01#t1441139504221
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kylewm isn't CMS a little strong of a word for most of the stuff we've written?
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snarfed.org edited /content_management_system (+229) "revise why" (view diff)
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snarfed.org edited /content_management_system (-115) "another why tweak" (view diff)
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aaronpk just launched a fun update to http://ownyourgram.com/
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aaronpk front page shows top people this week!
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snarfed aaronpk++
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Loqi aaronpk has 955 karma
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aaronpk kinda fun to see people using it that I don't know at all!
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KevinMarks hm, if brid.gy fixes #51 to send all mentions, I can put a comment box on svgur.com that wraps the twitter one
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@kylewmahan https://www.brid.gy update: launched support for backfeeding comments and faves from Flickr! Check it out, would love feedback #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/640283042854993921)
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kylewm I really want posse to a community blog for stuff like ^
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[snarfed] WOO LAUNCHED!!!
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[snarfed] kylewm++ congratulations!!!
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Loqi kylewm has 233 karma
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[snarfed] indienews it!
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myfreeweb kylewm++
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Loqi kylewm has 234 karma
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kylewm oh, hmm, i've never indienewsed something before, lemme try
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@myfreeweb remoteStorage could potentially work with IndieAuth… The only missing thing is the implicit grant flow (IndieAuth… (https://unrelenting.technology/notes/2015-09-05-22-16-35) (twitter.com/_/status/640287472446914560)
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myfreeweb kylewm: brid.gy publish created a tweet that's over 140 characters o_0 https://www.brid.gy/log?start_time=1441413320&key=aglzfmJyaWQtZ3lyXwsSDVB1Ymxpc2hlZFBhZ2UiOGh0dHBzOi8vdW5yZWxlbnRpbmcudGVjaG5vbG9neS9ub3Rlcy8yMDE1LTA5LTA1LTAwLTM1LTEzDAsSB1B1Ymxpc2gYgICAgICAgAoM
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myfreeweb also, it should retry when it gets a 500 from a website https://www.brid.gy/log?start_time=1441378862&key=aglzfmJyaWQtZ3lyXwsSDVB1Ymxpc2hlZFBhZ2UiOGh0dHBzOi8vdW5yZWxlbnRpbmcudGVjaG5vbG9neS9ub3Rlcy8yMDE1LTA5LTA0LTE1LTAwLTU5DAsSB1B1Ymxpc2gYgICAgICAgAoM
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kylewm myfreeweb: I believe it will retry
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kylewm myfreeweb: I'm adding your failed tweet attempt to https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/416
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[snarfed] publish doesn't currently retry
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[snarfed] myfreeweb: retries are definitely nice! but kind of a product/policy decision, often case by case. not exactly mandatory
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kylewm sorry didn't realize it was a publish
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aaronpk kylewm: submit to indienews!
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kylewm aaronpk: i did!
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kylewm [snarfed]: you down with trimming trailing punctuation before adding an ellipsis?
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aaronpk oh yay
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Loqi :D
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aaronpk maybe today is a good day to change how indienews works
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aaronpk https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieNews/issues/7 and https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieNews/issues/9
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snarfed lol sigh https://twitter.com/jsmarr/status/640293686815817728
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@jsmarr 8 years ago today, wow. Not clear we've made much progress since then. :/ https://twitter.com/jsmarr/status/248998142 (twitter.com/_/status/640293686815817728)
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aaronpk aw
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myfreeweb why is commenting on indienews even considered syndication? it's just a webmention comment
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aaronpk oh hey the URL is still up
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aaronpk myfreeweb: the idea is that you syndicate your comment from your own site to indienews
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aaronpk the in-reply-to URL would be the original story, not the indienews URL
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aaronpk I may just drop that whole thing tho since it's kind of a leap of the imagination and I'd rather get the simple flow of just submitting things there working well
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snarfed probably the right call
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aaronpk also there are only 2 comments ever and both are from me
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snarfed wow, kylewm did you make a new synd icon just for indienews?
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snarfed https://kylewm.com/2015/09/https-www-brid-gy-update-launched-support-for-backfeeding
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aaronpk haha nice
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aaronpk wow flickr support is gonna be great
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snarfed totally!
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kylewm aaronpk: I mean, I did pick one from font-awesome for indienews :)
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aaronpk poll: is upvoting useful if the front page is time-ordered instead of ranked?
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aaronpk i won't change it right now, but just thinking there's not much point to it if the front page isn't ranked
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kylewm +1 (ironically) removing upvotes
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aaronpk wow last real work done on this was december 2013
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KevinMarks so who has webactions working?
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KevinMarks do you get a webaction at the bottom of http://svgur.com/s/1d ?
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myfreeweb nope
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myfreeweb I guess it would work if I had the browser extension thing
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myfreeweb but the cool thing now is indie-config: your website loads my config using an iframe and replaces the twitter link with my link
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myfreeweb I have a Web Components implementation: https://github.com/myfreeweb/indieweb-components
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snarfed what's the inverse of u-syndication?
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snarfed ie how would an indieweb friendly silo mark up a POSSE post backlink
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snarfed u-syndication-of?
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aaronpk i thought it was just u-url?
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aaronpk that's what I did on indienews anyway
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snarfed ah yeah. i checked indienews but thought u-url meant it hadn't tried to handle it
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snarfed good point
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snarfed u-url it is
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aaronpk it means if you subscribe to the indienews home page in a reader, the reader will show the original link which is what you want
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KevinMarks there was an atom thing for that iirc
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myfreeweb wow, indie-config's web+action://load iframe causes Chrome to display a mixed content warning (but not Firefox)
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KevinMarks https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc4287#section-4.2.11
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KevinMarks though i don't think we h-feed ified that
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KevinMarks hah, I thought I had founda tree in the twitter logo, but that was because inkscape imported it over an open document, not in a new one
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GWG My first patch for WordPress has been promoted to 4.4 candidate. Those people are much harder to please than snarfed and pfefferle.
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snarfed GWG++ congratulations!
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Loqi GWG has 120 karma
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GWG snarfed: I haven't forgotten about the unit tests
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snarfed glad to hear it
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GWG snarfed: Been slowed down by a herniated disc and my tendency to jump around.
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GWG But I am getting Post Kinds fixed uo, including Micropub support.
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aaronpk kylewm: how would you feel about doing syndication this way: http://indiewebcamp.com/syndication-brainstorming#Syndicate_by_Reference
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aaronpk basically you first create a u-syndication link to http://news.indiewebcamp.com/ and send the webmention as normal, and the response will include the final URL and then you can update the syndication link on your site
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aaronpk basically the same way bridgy publish works i think
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kylewm yeah that's totally how bridgy publish works, i like that consistency
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aaronparecki.com edited /syndication-brainstorming (+123) "/* Syndicate by Reference */ use 201 for synchronous syndication, like micropub" (view diff)
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aaronpk cool
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aaronpk it's weird deleting so much code
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