#indiewebcamp 2015-01-17

2015-01-17 UTC
lukebrooker joined the channel
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snarfed
same person
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hober
i used a different machine
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edward.oconnor.cx
created /User:Edward.oconnor.cx (+12) "Created page with "Hi, I'm Ted.""
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tantek
hober++ woot!
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Loqi
hober has 1 karma
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tantek
voxpelli: do you want a bug for <base> support or do you already have one filed?
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voxpelli
tantek: I've already fixed it locally ;)
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snarfed
kylewm: you mean the first id in that path, not the third?
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tantek
voxpelli++ for supporting all the base!
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Loqi
voxpelli has 20 karma
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snarfed
probably because you signed up for bridgy before the migration to 2.x api
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GWG
snarfed: I'm seeing some duplication as well.
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snarfed
whee. sorry guys
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GWG
Tell me if there is anything I can do to help in testing
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snarfed
nah problem is already clear, described in the gh issue i linked
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GWG
snarfed: I already forgave you for the 75 push notifications to my phone
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GWG
Now I should decide if I should keep the new mentions you sent or the old ones
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tantek
it's good, we're learning how to handle spamming/throttling, indirectly ;)
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GWG
By the way, I've taken on another project
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GWG
With pfefferle's blessing, I'm going to work on the Indieweb WordPress plugin, after all the comments I got this week by confused people
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GWG
I want to make it easier for people who have WordPress sites to know what to do to indiewebify them
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kylewm
GWG: is that mostly a documentation issue?
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GWG
kylewm: Well, partly.
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GWG
But many people just install the plugin and let it recommend things.
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GWG
It bills itself as JetPack for the Indieweb.
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GWG
It needs a better presentation to do that. JetPack has a page where it really explains each module.
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kylewm
ah ok
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kylewm
I realized that Jetpack seems pretty similar to the realization benwerd is coming to about the limitations of shared hosting
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kylewm
in that jetpack seems to provide lots of features as services rather than plugins
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GWG
kylewm: It does both, which is my objection to it.
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benwerd
kylewm: definitely - and Jetpack is definitely a progressive enhancement rather than something that silos you, which is great
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@atomicules
I remember hearing about microformats years ago; didn't see the point in them then, but like the idea of #indieweb so...
(twitter.com/_/status/556247185608937474)
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@atomicules
...I've been adding h-entry and h-card to my site. Don't think I'll go as far as receiving webmentions though #indieweb
(twitter.com/_/status/556247483870105600)
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GWG
I do need a better description though than the one the plugin has now...
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GWG
"IndieWeb version of WordPress' Jetpack plugin" sounds misleading
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GWG
It is inspired by the idea of Jetpack, but it isn't a version of it
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kylewm
something like IndieWeb Starter Kit?
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GWG
It acts like a directory and installer of Indieweb Plugins
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GWG
It used to bundle them, but doesn't anymore
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GWG
Copywriting is hard
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kylewm
it really is
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kylewm
could stick with the jetpack theme, indieweb hoverboard :)
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GWG
The reason Jetpack was mentioned was for what it is...but it makes it sound like its a clone, not something with a similar purpose
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kylewm
I like it as a metaphor for like "turboboost your wordpress site"
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kylewm
something that similarly implied turbo-boost your indiewebness" might work?
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KevinMarks
What does jet pack do?
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tantek
what is jetpack?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "jetpack" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=jetpack
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GWG
I always gathered Jetpack was originally designed to add the features of Wordpress.com to a self-hosted WordPress install.
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GWG
But, the result is you need a wordpress.com account to use Jetpack
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tantek
so it's more like ball-and-chain?
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GWG
tantek: Well, to get the ball, you need the chain
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GWG
A lot of the features would require a service, thus an account, but many don't.
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GWG
Requiring a login to use code that has no need of a third-party seems wrong.
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kylewm
OK so best to break that association then :)
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kylewm
still brainstorming, stop me if this is not helpful... IndieWeb Docent/Guide/Tourguide/Handbook
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GWG
I use something called Slim Jetpack. It takes the code and removes the account requirement. But, either way...
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GWG
Guide works as one
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GWG
The other is plugin installer
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GWG
So, it's a directory of Indieweb plugins in that regard.
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GWG
But directory seems like something else
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kylewm
yeah directory is a little non-specific/boring
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snarfed
probably "bundle"
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GWG
But it doesn't bundle. It gets each plugin from its repository.
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KevinMarks_
the default name problem again?
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snarfed
GWG: oh, you're talkjing about "plugin installer," not the indieweb plugin? ok
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GWG
snarfed: It's the same thing. The Indieweb plugin is a plugin installer now. It no longer bundles Semantic Linkbacks and WordPress webmentions, it installs them
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snarfed
GWG: oh wow, ok. i see the benefits
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GWG
But, the description needs work
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snarfed
maybe "installer" then
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KevinMarks_
instead of giving it a noun, say what it does?
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KevinMarks_
"it enhances your wordpress site by connecting it to the indieweb"
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GWG
KevinMarks_: It doesn't. All it does is let you install other plugins
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GWG
So, it helps you enhance your WordPress site.
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kylewm
is that a plumbing distinction?
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KevinMarks_
on wednesday I sat with Jean as she tried to use ti, and we were confused
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kylewm
like, would a non-techy person care whether it installs stuff or bundles stuff?
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KevinMarks_
Indieweb Wizard
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KevinMarks_
(I suspect even MSFT don't call it that any more)
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GWG
kylewm: A non-techy person knows about WordPress plugins
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snarfed
kylewm: good point, probably no
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snarfed
more importantly, we've probably spent too much time debating the language
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snarfed
language is important, but also diminishing returns here
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KevinMarks_
the way the copy is written it confused us wheher it would install things or we had to do it manually
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snarfed
go build out the functionality, and if it's good, people won't care (much) how you describe it
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snarfed
KevinMarks_: good point
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KevinMarks_
maybe rebuild ti to be a bit more like indiewebify me?
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GWG
KevinMarks_: I now have commit authority, with pfefferle's permission, to fix the copy.
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GWG
That is what I'm thinking about.
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KevinMarks_
the bridgy/indieweb bundle is the attractive part I think
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KevinMarks_
as the twitter and FB comments are the most visible
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snarfed
ooh, you could definitely streamline the bridgy setup to one-click (plus oauth approvals) with https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/240
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snarfed
kylewm++ for implementing that
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Loqi
kylewm has 102 karma
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KevinMarks_
you are going to end up with posts like http://www.jeanmrussell.com/testing-brid-gy/
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GWG
There are two things I'm going to add.
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GWG
One is the 1-liner description. The other is the longer one. The longer one is easier
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KevinMarks_
changing jean's twitter profile to link to her site as the URL was part fo the brid.gy process too
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kylewm
would be amused if Wordpress beats Known to using the bridgy backdoor auth
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snarfed
ahahaha
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kylewm
KevinMarks_: actually that bridgy auth thing can help there too... one of Ben's requests was a way to specify the user's site to bridgy directly, and that overrides the silo profile URL settings
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KevinMarks_
yes, I was reading the issue thread
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kylewm
oh, duh :)
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KevinMarks_
though changing the twitter URL to the personal URL is useful for making indiewauth work
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KevinMarks_
one thing that writing that post made clear was that joining the indieweb is a lot of things
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@t
@atomicules excellent first steps. You also can setup a proxy to receive webmentions for you: https://webmention.herokuapp.com/ (ttk.me t4_B2)
(twitter.com/_/status/556288808900366336)
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Loqi
benwerd has 52 karma
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@simonv3
People I know in Edinburgh should get together for the IndieWeb meetup there http://indiewebcamp.com/2015/Edinburgh @digitalWestie
(twitter.com/_/status/556291920641536000)
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tantek
benwerd: hmm - your post doesn't seem to be getting my reply
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tantek
Pretty sure I've commented successfully on werd.io before - thus I'm curious what may be going wrong
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tantek
aside, I'm finding it quite enjoyable to post likes and webmention them from my own site
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tantek
especially indie-to-indie
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tantek
the facepile display is quite compelling
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tantek
definitely motivating to like more indie posts
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tantek
snarfed, kylewm what does "{ "error": "Error: 'bool' object has no attribute 'lower'" }" mean as a return from Bridgy Publish of a Facebook "like"?
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snarfed
heh, sorry, tantek, it means i'm fixing fb api upgrade bugs
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snarfed
huh, that's odd though
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tantek
hmm - the like apparently did go through though
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tantek
ok I'll ignore it :)
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snarfed
yeah, just the response is unhappy
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snarfed
anyway. sorry. will be fixed soon!
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tantek
np - just wanted to give you a heads-up :)
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snarfed
thanks
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tantek.com
edited /ruby_parser (+48) "/* Blocking */ citation nested not supported"
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kylewm
tantek: Known doesn't like h-cites right now. I have the same problem
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tantek
good evening #indiewebcamp!
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GWG
Good evening, tantek
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tantek
kylewm: huh - good to know.
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tantek
!tell snarfed,kylewm does Bridgy Publish have challenges with liking a comment (reply) on a comment on a photo post? e.g. http://tantek.com/2015/016/f9
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek
!tell snarfed,kylewm just got a "{ "error": "Error: Forbidden HTTP Error 403: Forbidden" }" response from submitting http://tantek.com/2015/016/f13 to Bridgy Publish for Twitter, but the favoriting of the tweet worked.
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek
!tell snarfed,kylewm n.m. re: f13 - it was a duplicate post on my end and the 403 may have been from trying to favorite a tweet twice.
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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@rachnaaz
RT @salisburymw: I hope my #BRCA testing saga helps to shed light on the problems facing genetic testing. #ownyourdata @techonomy http://t.…
(twitter.com/_/status/556371026641051648)
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@webrocker
kommentarmoderation im blog + webmentions sind eine… spannende kombination. aber so eine prall gefüllte inbox am morgen hat auch was :)
(twitter.com/_/status/556372166791680000)
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@ThatEmil
Thinking that Webmention acceptance status could be implemented using view decorators in django. Now, to read up on Python decorators...
(twitter.com/_/status/556384946185842688)
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wwelves.org perpetual-tripper
edited /Trovebox (+102) "Trovebox will shut down on March 15, 2015"
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@atomicules
@t I am going to start using u-in-reply-to and u-repost-of though #indieweb
(twitter.com/_/status/556418673922293760)
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snarfed
!tell tantek bridgy publish doesn't (yet) support liking comments
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Loqi
snarfed: tantek left you a message 4 hours, 5 minutes ago: does Bridgy Publish have challenges with liking a comment (reply) on a comment on a photo post? e.g. http://tantek.com/2015/016/f9
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snarfed
looks like the failure mode isn't great though, i'll fix that
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Loqi
snarfed: tantek left you a message 4 hours, 3 minutes ago: just got a "{ "error": "Error: Forbidden HTTP Error 403: Forbidden" }" response from submitting http://tantek.com/2015/016/f13 to Bridgy Publish for Twitter, but the favoriting of the tweet worked.
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Loqi
snarfed: tantek left you a message 3 hours, 35 minutes ago: n.m. re: f13 - it was a duplicate post on my end and the 403 may have been from trying to favorite a tweet twice.
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Loqi
snarfed: tantek left you a message 3 hours, 35 minutes ago: n.m. re: f13 - it was a duplicate post on my end and the 403 may have been from trying to favorite a tweet twice.
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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@webrocker
@pixelbande @yellowled ahso, mailbox ist nur voll wg der webmentions die da reinballern, nicht wg übermässigem trollismus :)
(twitter.com/_/status/556422255266525185)
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Loqi
[mention] Michiel de Jong posted 'Joining the Indie Web: my Motivation (CC-BY Michiel de Jong, February 2014) 17 min read TL;D...' linking to https://indiewebcamp.com/ (https://michielbdejong.com/2015/joining-the-indie-web-my-motivation-cc-by-michiel-de-jong)
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Loqi
[mention] Michiel de Jong posted 'Joining the Indie Web: my Motivation (CC-BY Michiel de Jong, February 2014) 17 min read TL;D...' linking to http://indiewebcamp.com/why (https://michielbdejong.com/2015/joining-the-indie-web-my-motivation-cc-by-michiel-de-jong)
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Loqi
[mention] Michiel de Jong posted 'Joining the Indie Web: my Motivation (CC-BY Michiel de Jong, February 2014) 17 min read TL;D...' linking to https://indiewebcamp.com/2012/Positive_Arguments (https://michielbdejong.com/2015/joining-the-indie-web-my-motivation-cc-by-michiel-de-jong)
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Loqi
[mention] Michiel de Jong posted 'Joining the Indie Web: my Motivation (CC-BY Michiel de Jong, February 2014) 17 min read TL;D...' linking to http://indiewebcamp.com/indiemark (https://michielbdejong.com/2015/joining-the-indie-web-my-motivation-cc-by-michiel-de-jong)
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KartikPrabhu
loqi playback?
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snarfed
hey Jeena, any news on your webmention handler?
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snarfed
(it's been 500ing for a bit :P)
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GWG
!tell pfefferle Pushed a bunch of changes into the WordPress Indieweb Repository. Wanted your opinion so far
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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david.shanske.com
edited /WordPress (-211) "/* webmention */"
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david.shanske.com
edited /WordPress (-35) "/* Login Security Plugins */"
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kylewm
tommorris: I sent mf2py a PR for the newly clarified "value" parsing spec
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Loqi
kylewm: tantek left you a message 9 hours, 21 minutes ago: does Bridgy Publish have challenges with liking a comment (reply) on a comment on a photo post? e.g. http://tantek.com/2015/016/f9
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Loqi
kylewm: tantek left you a message 9 hours, 19 minutes ago: just got a "{ "error": "Error: Forbidden HTTP Error 403: Forbidden" }" response from submitting http://tantek.com/2015/016/f13 to Bridgy Publish for Twitter, but the favoriting of the tweet worked.
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Loqi
kylewm: tantek left you a message 8 hours, 51 minutes ago: n.m. re: f13 - it was a duplicate post on my end and the 403 may have been from trying to favorite a tweet twice.
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david.shanske.com
edited /WordPress () "(-2777) /* WordPress.com hosting service */"
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michielbdejong
how can I use microformats to publish a list of people I know, in the sense of https://twitter.com/michielbdejong/following ?
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david.shanske.com
edited /WordPress (+89) "/* WordPress.com hosting service */"
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david.shanske.com
edited /WordPress (+412) "/* Criticism */"
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david.shanske.com
edited /WordPress (+33) "/* Indieweb Plugin */"
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david.shanske.com
edited /WordPress (+192) "/* Themes */"
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tantek
fascinating - wondering about implications for the indieweb: http://www.wsj.com/articles/BL-DGB-39904
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Loqi
tantek: snarfed left you a message 5 hours, 33 minutes ago: bridgy publish doesn't (yet) support liking comments
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tantek
I suppose I should file an issue then, since I now have a real world example :)
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@wesocialTv
#WebMention - I politici più citati in rete | infografica dati Polimeter. https://twitter.com/wesocialTv/status/556534004896526336/photo/1
(twitter.com/_/status/556534004896526336)
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david.shanske.com
created /Getting_Started_on_WordPress (+1627) "Created page with "=Getting Started on WordPress = It is easy to get started with IndieWeb on WordPress. This plugin will help you set up the plugins that will enhance your site. Not all plugins ...""
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Jeena
snarfed, hm I'll have to look into it, perhaps I should let it send me a mail when it is 500ing
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Jeena
ok: This installation of RMagick was configured with ImageMagick 6.8.8 but ImageMagick 6.9.0-3 is in use.
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Jeena
I'll reinstall RMagick
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kylewm
does anybody know if there is a procedure for moving Known from a subdomain to the main domain? known.mydomain.com to mydomain.com?
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kylewm
most things seem to still work after moving, but there are references to known.mydomain.com in the DB still
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kevinmarks.com
edited /Getting_Started_on_WordPress (+156) "rephrase to be more goal focused"
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snarfed
KevinMarks_: interesting. the key point i can't tell from the post is whether he ran his tests this on the same datasets as in the literature
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snarfed
he says "billions of edges" and "GB of data," but not whether they were the same
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KevinMarks_
I thought he linked the datasets?
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snarfed
aha yes thanks
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snarfed
nm that paragraph answers my q
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snarfed
same dataset as the graphx paper
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snarfed
so that comparison is fair at least
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snarfed
totally agree with the conclusion that for small to medium data - which most data is! - less is more
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KevinMarks_
also the amount of RAM in an off the shelf machine has gone up a lot since pagerank was written
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snarfed
sure, but same with servers
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KevinMarks_
also, he did page it all in first, which is cheating a bit
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snarfed
oh man yes
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KevinMarks_
part of the point of mapreduce vs db's is 'touch each piece of data once'
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snarfed
esp considering disk io (specifically seeks) dominates lots of those workloads
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snarfed
ssds have changed that somewhat, but not entirely
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KevinMarks_
wasn't "no seeks" part of the mapreduce rationale too?
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KevinMarks_
you're not doing index read/data read but just straight data read?
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snarfed
fair. they halfway avoid them, and halfway trade them off for network RPCs, since you still have to logically seek during shuffle
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snarfed
but that happens in way bigger batches, so it was a win
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KevinMarks_
and at shuffle stage you have everything in RAM across the cluster
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snarfed
depending on config. you could opt to not keep everything pinned in ram, if you had a lot of data and not a lot of machine budget
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snarfed
some groups did that often
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snarfed
but initially yes
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Phyks
is there any way to post files through micropub ? (to link images to a post for instance)
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Phyks
I read the wiki page but it does not seem to be included
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david.shanske.com
edited /Webmention_Plugin (+15) "/* Related Plugins */"
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david.shanske.com
edited /Webmention_Plugin (+297) "/* Configuration */"
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david.shanske.com
edited /Webmention_Plugin (+0) "/* Configuration */"
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david.shanske.com
edited /WordPress (-191) "/* webmention */"
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david.shanske.com
edited /WordPress (+39) "/* Adding Indieweb Support/Elements to a Wordpress Site */"
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GWG
KevinMarks_: How's that so far?
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KevinMarks
That's good - reframing by function.
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KevinMarks
Can you explain the template issues too?
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KevinMarks
'cos that is a bit confusing
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KevinMarks_
er, hi bridgy
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tantek
hey at least Bridgy doesn't support Medium yet. :P ;)
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KevinMarks_
I was goign to do medium next
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KevinMarks_
also I now have a webmention of myself again
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KevinMarks_
looks liek my blog template neeeds some mf2 work
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tantek
KevinMarks: I figured Medium was next
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tantek
consider doing that Monday (early) morning
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tantek
er, make that Tuesday
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tantek
since Monday is MLK
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KevinMarks_
tweet embeds didn't make it over