#indiewebcamp 2014-09-21

2014-09-21 UTC
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KartikPrabhu
bear: I do see that you are not using the http->https redirect for my site.
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bear
yea, that is what i'm fixing now
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bear
the gather code is rather simple - adding code to get the redirect chain
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bear
I was just assuming the url passed into the code via the seeding step was valid
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bear
but now i'm going to make a HEAD request and only store it if it's a 200 and then store the response.url
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KartikPrabhu
so no redirects?
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bear
no response.url should be the last of the redirects
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KartikPrabhu
aah ok cool
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bear
well, once I add allow_redirects=True
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bear
that is
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KartikPrabhu
excerpts: "Then if they try to understand, they go to mailing lists and they see those fights and all the politics and… they step back, or disappear for good."
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KartikPrabhu
"Perhaps we need to discuss more about use cases and patterns for writing modular components and extending them."
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bear
nice article
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bear
ok, domain gathering now follows redirects
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bear.im
edited /indie-stats (+0) "refreshed data which changed timestamp"
(view diff)
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bear
copies fresh data to site
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tantek.com
edited /indie-stats (+32) "see also analytics"
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bear
the next thing I need to add is a "domain edit" feature
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tantek.com
edited /indie (+81) "*-config, *-stats"
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bear
so anyone with indieauth can update the domain data
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tantek.com
edited /indie (-24) "/* Prefix */ found indie-contacts link/session"
(view diff)
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bear
tantek - I registered indie-stats.com indie-stats.org and indiestats.com
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tantek
neat. with indiestats.com - why any need for the others?
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bear
indiestats.com was not available
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bear
fingers
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bear
so I registered indiestats.org
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tantek
sounds good
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bear
I thought indie-stats.com sounded better
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bear
i'm hoping that someone else in the community has indiestats.com
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tantek
meh - I always thought hyphens in domain names made them look less legit
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bear
we have a year to figure it out ;)
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pdurbin
experts-exchange.com
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bear
pdurbin++
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Loqi
pdurbin has 2 karma
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tantek
was than an example or counter-example?
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pdurbin
probably didn't want "sexchange" in the middle
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bear
an example of why - is so helpful
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tantek
aha - yeah, dumb internet filters
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bear
goes to find some food before talking a non-trivial web edit page
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tantek
pdurbin - that may be the funniest nerdy thing I've seen all day - "reasons to include a hyphen in your domain name: if you have a name like experts-exchange.com"
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tantek
pdurbin++
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bear
and for me - anything with more than two text fields is non-trivial ;)
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Loqi
pdurbin has 3 karma
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@j_antman
RT @postwait: Wow. Words cannot express... if you want to be a web developer, stay away from here: http://indiewebcamp.com/database-antipattern
(twitter.com/_/status/513484388966080512)
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pdurbin
tantek: jeff atwood mentioned it on the stackoverflow podcast. I guess it stuck with me. or maybe it was joel spolsky
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tantek
great reference
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tantek
perhaps we should mention it on /domain-name
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KartikPrabhu
is the wiki PG? :P
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pdurbin
think of the children
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tantek
we can just document it as a positive example without explaining it
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kylewm
pdurbin: ha, i think that is where i heard it too
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pdurbin
i listened to every episode. good podcast overall. too bad jeff isn't on the newer one
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pdurbin
i guess he's off fixing markdown these days
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tantek
pdurbin - are you watching the edgeconf.com live video feed? good stuff.
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pdurbin
hmm, i love me some podcasts but I don't typically watch live feeds
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tantek
some high quality webdev stuff
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bret
woop, got syndication links working: http://bret.io/2014/09/21/now-i-just-have-to-m/
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pdurbin
clicks
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pdurbin
huh. it totally makes sense that akamai has an office in SF but being in Boston I never considered this
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pdurbin
I'll be in SF a week from now. Giving a talk at JavaOne.
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kylewm
bret: what thing were you using to encode urls in nodejs?
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bret
kylewm ones ec
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kylewm
bret: thank you, and did it encode key=value1&key=value2, or were there other weird characters in there?
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bret
errmm
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bret
let me check again
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bret
Im pretty sure that was the encoded version of {"syndicate-to": [url1, url2]}
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bret
> urlencode.encode({"syndicate-to": ["twitter.com/bret", "facebook.com/bret"]})
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bret
'syndicate-to%5B%5D=twitter.com%2Fbret&syndicate-to%5B%5D=facebook.com%2Fbret'
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bret
thats what *a* node url encoder does
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bret
does that look correct? or is micropubs thing correct
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kylewm
it's setting the parameter name to "syndicate-to[]"
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bret
srlsly?
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bret
lol "'syndicate-to[]=twitter.com/bret&syndicate-to[]=facebook.com/bret'"
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bret
Shit I wonder if there is a better way to do this
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kylewm
the [] is common, i'm not sure whether it has any actual meaning other than convention
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kylewm
for multivalued form parameters
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bret
reposting for history:
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bret
[18:10:49] <tantek> i cant see the posting ui
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bret
[18:12:54] <bret> tantek the screenshot is of the posting UI, but a screenshot on the home page would be good
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bret
[18:13:19] <tantek> right - I can't see why I'm bothering with all the setup at https://quill.p3k.io/auth/start
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kylewm
tantek: a screenshot of textboxes on the homepage? wouldn't that be confusing?
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bret
It would be in context
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tantek
the UI should be on the home page
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bret
so, a screenshot of a browser window
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tantek
and *with* a login box
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tantek
if you're not logged in
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tantek
flatten the whole thing
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bret
oh that would actually be better, just grey out everything
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bret
kylewm re []... interesting. I wonder how my parser actually treats it
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kylewm
all examples i found were in php
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kylewm
and i don't know php well enough to know what magic it was doing
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bret
ill ask aaronpk or barnaby when either is around.
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bret
I mean, Im not apposed to splitting and joining parameters
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kylewm
bret: I added a Code Coverage badge like you :) https://github.com/kylewm/mf2util/blob/master/README.md
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kylewm
bret++
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Loqi
bret has 26 karma
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bret
nice kylewm!
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bret
kylewm++
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Loqi
kylewm has 53 karma
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bret
pretty easy? what did you use?
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kylewm
bret: Coveralls
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kylewm
the only weird part is some random python distutils nonsense
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bret
kylewm yeah that is a little weird. thats why I used code climate
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bret
but they don't do python yet :(
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bret
it uses http://gotwarlost.github.io/istanbul/ instead of proprietary libs
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Phae
Tantek is busy praising how great this channel is
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Loqi
Phae: tantek left you a message 3 weeks, 4 days ago: you coming tomorrow night too, right? Add yourselves! http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-07-30-homebrew-website-club#RSVP
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Phae
So naggy. :P
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fberriman.com blog
edited /IRC_People (+110) "/* Nicknames */ Added myself"
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KartikPrabhu
Phae: the "tweet" link on your homepage does not link to your twitter it seems
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Phae
Meh. Oh well.
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@kevinmarks
@anildash @waxpancake why the silo? #ownyourdata - @withknown supports hosting music with POSSE to soundcloud
(twitter.com/_/status/513552123829579776)
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@kyle_wm
@duckinator i wrote that Q in re to http://indiewebcamp.com/database-antipattern#Platform_trap (i.e. "flat files work everywhere"). my point was that they don't. @kevinmarks
(twitter.com/_/status/513556863988686849)
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KartikPrabhu
man why don't people write actual artilces instead of multi-tweet things that are hard to read
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kylewm
the Platform trap section is bogus anyway, I can't think of any database that prevents you from using any particular language or OS
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kylewm
except maybe MS Access?
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KartikPrabhu
maybe. but using a line-by-line critique misses the context and the point
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KartikPrabhu
really does not care much about this database war
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petermolnar
> man why don't people write actual artilces instead of multi-tweet things that are hard to read < THIS
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petermolnar
I totally agree :)
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kylewm
will take your advice
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kylewm
not that it was directed at me particularly
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kylewm
I'm very frustrated about the database thing though
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kylewm
things that would be fun lively debates in person turn into personal attacks on twitter :(
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KartikPrabhu
kylewm: yeah I know.
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petermolnar
it's not just twitter, mostly any online communication ends up like that soon, including forums & most of the mailing lists
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KartikPrabhu
anything short form will do that
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KartikPrabhu
kylewm: also I don't mean to dissuade you from following this debate. Someone has to :)
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kylewm.com
edited /Loqi (+198) "/* Ideas */ limit the number of RT notifications for a given post."
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kylewm
KartikPrabhu: I'm an only child. I don't handle confrontation well ;)
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KartikPrabhu
ha! I do, but I end up making it more confrontational :P
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kylewm.com
edited /storage (-134) "/* Markdown plus extensions */ remove me"
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@rtaibah
Another one bites the dust. OhLife is shutting down in October. #indieWeb http://ohlife.com/shutdown
(twitter.com/_/status/513582462371241984)
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tantek
oh what?
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@cubicgarden
@Jas Not heard of it, but looks good. Seems very much #indieweb style whichi is good @withknown
(twitter.com/_/status/513582647847956480)
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tantek
kylewm - we should document current db / flat file usage
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tantek
and explicitly note the divergence of approaches
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KevinMarks
anyone want to help me unbreak noterlive? - I think it's time to integrate micropub, but the heroku hosting breaks on me
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tantek
KevinMarks - how hard would it be to move it from heroku to "normal" web hosting
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KevinMarks
it's not much code, especially server-side
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kylewm
KevinMarks: what part is broken?
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KevinMarks
I can run it locally; when I deploy to heroku I get a dead app
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KevinMarks
2014-09-21T05:59:23.222504+00:00 app[web.1]: Error: Cannot find module './proto' 2014-09-21T05:59:23.222510+00:00 app[web.1]: at Module.require (module.js:364:17) 2014-09-21T05:59:23.216968+00:00 app[web.1]: throw err;
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tantek
What is Heroku?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "Heroku" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=Heroku
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kylewm
KevinMarks: I got a little bit farther http://kwm-noterlive.herokuapp.com/
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kylewm
though I'm not able to login
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kylewm
it redirects me to noterlive.com
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KevinMarks
yeah, that's stupidly hardcoded
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kylewm
all I did was bump express up to the latest 3.x version "express": "3.17.4",
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kylewm
oh and actually I removed node_modules from git, but I don't know if you're supposed to do that or not
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KevinMarks
sounds like a good idea
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KevinMarks
as we want heroku to recreate them
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@kevinmarks
#indieweb @kyle_wm: I got a little bit farther
(twitter.com/_/status/513588565272694784)
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KevinMarks
well, it works if I hack the redirect URL back from twitter
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KevinMarks
so that should be an ENV
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KevinMarks
hm, looking better
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KevinMarks
I think the node_modules was the key part
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KevinMarks
kylewm++
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Loqi
kylewm has 54 karma
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KevinMarks
I think at some point I committed my node_modules, and thanks to git being ambiguous, adding them to the exclusion file didn't work
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@kyle_wm
#indieweb @kyle_wm: I've seen noterlive demoed a couple times but never tried it myself, it is really cool!
(twitter.com/_/status/513591226185285632)
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@kevinmarks
#indieweb @kyle_wm: oh and actually I removed node_modules from git http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-09-21/line/1411283840785 (thanks Kyle, derp on my part)
(twitter.com/_/status/513591467332599808)
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KevinMarks
I have noterlive.com working again yay!
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Loqi
does a happy dance!
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KevinMarks
now I can do that whole micropub integration thing I started at indiewebcamp sf
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kylewm
yay! good night all :)
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Loqi
buenas noches
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KevinMarks
though making the URL not hardcoded would be good too
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kylewm
hard-coding urls is a core tenet of self-dogfooding
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KartikPrabhu
KevinMarks: hurray! noterlive looked awesome when I saw it in action once, But then it broke. good for collaborative debigging
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shaners
benatkin: (missed your question yesterday) I tend to use either Webrick (in the Ruby standard lib) or Puma (puma.io) (for both dev and prod on heorku)
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shaners
butter: Who are you? Can you add yourself to: https://indiewebcamp.com/irc-people please?
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@veganstraightedge
I wish @aral would've chosen a different name than "indie tech" and "ind.ie". #indieweb was already around. This just confuses people.
(twitter.com/_/status/513606545754447874)
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neuro`
Good morning.
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tommorris.org
edited /Facebook (+215) "/* Real Name demands */ adding another story"
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@u203d
@ojmason @congabonga Hm, so a POSSE solution for articles, probably doable with http://indiewebcamp.com/Known with some effort
(twitter.com/_/status/513673482400706560)
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@badgermind
@andyravensable will do survey tomorrow when at a computer - am thinking about blog UX for projects of my own after @IndieWebCampUK
(twitter.com/_/status/513674068831506432)
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@Mr_Sbrillo
HEY! New post on our blog! COme and discover our new logo! #BESEgames #gamedev #indieweb #videogames #logo
(twitter.com/_/status/513683054284779520)
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@GamingMuchroom
RT @Mr_Sbrillo: HEY! New post on our blog! COme and discover our new logo! #BESEgames #gamedev #indieweb #videogames #logo
(twitter.com/_/status/513683116113002496)
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@Parodossy
Mr_Sbrillo: HEY! New post on our blog! COme and discover our new logo! #BESEgames #gamedev #indieweb #videogames #logo
(twitter.com/_/status/513684420390567936)
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@GamingMuchroom
RT @Parodossy: Mr_Sbrillo: HEY! New post on our blog! COme and discover our new logo! #BESEgames #gamedev #indieweb #videogames #logo
(twitter.com/_/status/513684437591404545)
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@BillSeitz
@joeld @davextreme @manton any visible examples of back-and-forth BlogThread using WebMention? #OpenTwitter
(twitter.com/_/status/513694912106475520)
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parzzix
Started an Known installation, installed mongodb, but the install script is asking for SQL? does that mean no more mongodb?
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tantek
good morning!
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KartikPrabhu
morning tantek
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tantek
reads today's logs
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tantek
congrats kevinmarks and kylewm for unbreaking noterlive!
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rascul
parzzix it should work happily with either though i've only used mysql for i
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parzzix
rascul, is their a way to tell it to use mongo?
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tantek
KartikPrabhu, kylewm you two post indie reply threads quite a bit - want to reply to https://twitter.com/BillSeitz/status/513694912106475520 and clue them into the fact that this is a solved problem and folks here in the community are doing this all the time?
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@BillSeitz
@joeld @davextreme @manton any visible examples of back-and-forth BlogThread using WebMention? #OpenTwitter
(twitter.com/_/status/513694912106475520)
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@joeld
.@gRegorLove? RT @BillSeitz: @joeld @davextreme @manton any visible examples of back-and-forth BlogThread using WebMention? #OpenTwitter
(twitter.com/_/status/513699407129505792)
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tantek
yeah that ^^^
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rascul
parzzix best i can do for you is link you to the docs, it mentions mongodb http://docs.withknown.com/en/latest/install/instructions.html
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: I think they are looking for http://indiewebcamp.com/reply-chain
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tantek
didn't ben_thatmust solve that?
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parzzix
rascul, ok thanks
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KartikPrabhu
tantek yes
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Loqi
agreed.
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rascul
parzzix you can have it hosted at withknown.com if you donn't want to do all the setup
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tantek
Loqi, could you do that for me?
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parzzix
rascul, I have one there, but even if I forward and mask domain, the rel-me links don't seem to work.
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rascul
ahh ok
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: yes looking for the said example
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KartikPrabhu
neat I'll add both
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tantek
awesome thanks!
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tantek
ben_thatmust's accomplishment deserves it's own post though
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kartikprabhu.com
edited /reply-chain (+179) "/* Indieweb Examples */ add ben_thatmustbeme example"
(view diff)
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tantek
but his posts don't have rel-syndication links to the POSSE copies!
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tantek
so if I want to POSSE thread reply I have to go dig for the tweet copy :/
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tantek
that's not it - it's that not all his notes/replies are POSSE'd to twitter
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tantek
makes it hard to reply!
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tantek
ok fine I will do a multi-reply!
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tantek
ah - he himself is not reply-threading his POSSE tweets
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ben_thatmust
whats up?
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KartikPrabhu
I added your reply-chains as examples to the wiki
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KartikPrabhu
maybe you want to expand on it, add screenshots or something
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ben_thatmust
ahh, just reading back on that thread
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@t
Well done Ben Roberts! 2014-09-12 First #indieweb federated reply-context thread presentation: https://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2014/9/12/1/_ (ttk.me t4YE1)
(twitter.com/_/status/513704854519549952)
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tantek
oops forgot that Twitter requires an @-reference to reply thread
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KartikPrabhu
now you can't edit it :P
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ben_thatmust
yeah tantek, the first reply was set to POSSE to twitter via twitter, the second one tries to but uses brid.gy and since what i was replying to wasn't posse'd to twitter, it doesn't posse to twitter
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ben_thatmust
i believe
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ben_thatmust
at the time i had every note set to send to twitter via bridgy
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@t
Well done @dissolve333! 2014-09-12 First #indieweb federated reply-context thread presentation https://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2014/9/12/1/_ (ttk.me t4YE1)
(twitter.com/_/status/513705594218631168)
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tantek
KartikPrabhu watch me :D ^^^
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KartikPrabhu
waaaa.... how!?
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KartikPrabhu
you have Twitter pro or something?
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tantek
KartikPrabhu: POSSE CRUD of course ;) http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE#CRUD and http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE#Update in particular :D
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tantek
oh and now for the curl webmentions
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tantek
well that half worked. https://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2014/9/12/1/_ shows my reply
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tantek
ben_thatmust: are you only checking *inside* the e-content?
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tantek
for the webmention source?
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ben_thatmust
no, i should be looking for it... let me check whats up
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tantek
I sent exactly one webmention to each of those posts
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KartikPrabhu
of course I picked an example where I was called "insightful" ;)
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ben_thatmust
huh, weird, its still showing those mentions as queued in the DB
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ben_thatmust
the webmention i'm showing came from bridgy, came it just before the cron ran
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tantek
kylewm - since when did you start showing reply-context threads?!? https://kylewm.com/reply/2014/08/31/1/wow-that-is-really-insightful-you
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ben_thatmust
your's came it just after
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ben_thatmust
so it should display them in 6 minutes
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tantek
ben_thatmust: I see them now!
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tantek
so now the question is, can you implement de-duping of my comment here https://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2014/9/12/1/_
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ben_thatmust
oh there we are, i forgot, that cron is on 5 minutes
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ben_thatmust
yeah, thats a good question, they are coming in from 2 sources
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tantek
"Ideally, recipients should try to de-dupe webmention sources, preferring an original post "
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ben_thatmust
not in this case the tweet/brid.gy copy came it first, which doesn't actually have a link back to your page. what I can do though is when i get a webmention with rel-syndication i can find updates from that
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tantek
the tweet copy doesn't need a link back to my page!
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tantek
oh shoot red link
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tantek
in particular: 5. otherwise if a parenthetical permashortlink citation is the last thing in the POSSE'd copy content, convert that to a URL, use that as the candidate URL
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ben.thatmustbe.me
edited /User:Ben.thatmustbe.me (+157) "/* OpenBlog */"
(view diff)
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ben_thatmust
on my de-deduplication
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ben_thatmust
s/de-duplication/todo list
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tantek.com
edited /original-post-discovery (+23) "/* Algorithm */ link to permashortcitation"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /User:Ben.thatmustbe.me (+106) "link to algorithms to make it easier"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
what is reply-thread?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "reply-thread" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=reply-thread
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KartikPrabhu
tantek redirect ^ to reply-chain ?
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neuro`
Good not sure what part of the day.
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tantek
!tell kylewm - is this a multi-reply or are you displaying a reply-context *thread* the way that ben_thatmust does? https://kylewm.com/reply/2014/08/31/1/wow-that-is-really-insightful-you
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: that is a reply thread for sure
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KartikPrabhu
oh hmm maybe not so sure now
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tantek
KartikPrabhu: no it could be a manual multi-reply
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ben_thatmust
no, its a multi-reply
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KartikPrabhu
good time neuro`
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ben_thatmust
at least it looks that way
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KartikPrabhu
ben_thatmust: it also "looks" like a reply thread :P
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tantek
is reply-thread or reply-chain better?
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KartikPrabhu
traditional blog term is thread no?
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tantek
ok thread it is
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tantek.com
moved /reply-chain to /reply-thread "thread is more often used than chain"
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tantek.com
edited /reply-thread (+116) "reword dfn, subhead for ben, sublist, since 2014-09-12"
(view diff)
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ben_thatmust
i should probably do a post about the algorith i use
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Loqi
I agree
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ben_thatmust
thanks Loqi
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Loqi
you're welcome
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tantek.com
edited /reply-context (+23) "/* reply thread */ main article, link with date rather than just "here""
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ben_thatmust
tantek, your replies don't include at timezone at all :(
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Loqi
aww, cheer up
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KartikPrabhu
default to UTC ?
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GWG
ben_thatmust: Does tantek have a timezone problem too?
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ben_thatmust
KartikPrabhu, i default back to the time the message came in if its not there, i believe i take the time on the post if it isn't precise and just assume its local time to me
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ben_thatmust
everything i display is localtime, but my posts also contain the full datetime in ISO format
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ben_thatmust
i went about normalizing everything to localtime a while ago on my site
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bret.io
edited /Quill (+72) "Added screenshot and me"
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bret.io
edited /Quill (+6) "Resized image"
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bret.io
edited /Twitter (+6) "/* Downtime */ Resized image (was too big)"
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tantek
GWG yes I have a timezone problem
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tantek
my posts are in US/Pacific - without explicitly noting that in the data. it's a bug I need to fix.
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GWG
tantek, ditto.
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ben_thatmust
heh, i'm like the TZ checker
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GWG
ben_thatmust: I fixed the div
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ben_thatmust
excellent GWG
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kylewm
tantek: yep, plain old manual multi reply
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Loqi
kylewm: tantek left you a message 25 minutes ago: - is this a multi-reply or are you displaying a reply-context *thread* the way that ben_thatmust does? https://kylewm.com/reply/2014/08/31/1/wow-that-is-really-insightful-you
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KartikPrabhu
aww no reply-thread by kylewm
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@distobj
RT @t: Well done @dissolve333! 2014-09-12 First #indieweb federated reply-context thread presentation https://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2014/9/12/1/_ (ttk.me t4YE1)
(twitter.com/_/status/513723659643785217)
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kartikprabhu.com
created /file-storage (+373) "stubbed a page"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
kylewm: ask and you shall receive!
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kartikprabhu.com
edited /file-storage (+259) "remove MySQL mis-type. add myself to wants to list"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
!tell tantek add yourself to /file-storage ?
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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kartikprabhu.com
edited /file-storage (+95) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ add Bundle and article file ref."
(view diff)
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kartikprabhu.com
edited /database-antipattern (+19) "/* See Also */ add file storage link"
(view diff)
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kylewm
"Has played with YAML-based storage but does not like it." teehee
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@derRaab
RT @karenmcgrane: Ooookay, sure. “For any content you care about, don't put the primary copy in a database.” http://indiewebcamp.com/database-antipattern via @cr
(twitter.com/_/status/513657683082493953)
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kartikprabhu.com
edited /database (+32) "/* See Also */ add file storage link"
(view diff)
eschnou, alexhartley and KevinMarks joined the channel
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kylewm
KartikPrabhu: this "ThoughtStreams" site is interesting, have not seen it before
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kylewm
basically formalized Tweetstorms
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KartikPrabhu
kylewm: me neither came across it from the webmention tweet discussion
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KartikPrabhu
I wonder how they reckon to do webmention through RSS
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KartikPrabhu
"But the fact is, there's no way to guarantee you'll know if someone mentions you, because there's nothing forcing them to send that notification." yes. nothing should force them to send a mention anyway, it is their choice!
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kylewm
danlyke is working on that i think :) proactively spidering his friends to find mentions
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KartikPrabhu
I wouldn't like that
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KartikPrabhu
and it doesn't work for people you know anyway
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kylewm
don't^
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KartikPrabhu
yeah don't*
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kylewm
I think the idea is you check for mentions from friends and friends of friends, and anything is a pretty high probability to be spam
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KartikPrabhu
errr on 2nd thoughts that is what bridgy does :P
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kylewm
anything else*
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KartikPrabhu
so you could spider someone's RSS feed and if it had a reply to your article then parse said article in the RSS feed and add it. But again duplication of efforts and data wrt to HTML
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kylewm
mimicks snarfed and backs away slowly from RSS vs. HTML
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@danlyke
.@poachable I'd go out of my way to support and even champion any company which used personal URL/IndieWeb/micro formats profiles!
(twitter.com/_/status/513736381676273665)
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KevinMarks
Check for mentions from everyone else? That sounds familiar...
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KevinMarks
I solved the rss problem - you parse html, feed.unmung.com turns rss/atom into html for you
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KartikPrabhu
KevinMarks++ for unmung RSS->HTML
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Loqi
KevinMarks has 56 karma
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@andrewschepers
@WithKnown's answer to #IndieWeb looks very promising. How about LinkedIn, Instagram, WP & G+ integrations? TWiG 266: http://twit.tv/show/this-week-in-google/266
(twitter.com/_/status/513744700419743744)
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@HongPong
who's making open souce git commits on a Sunday? this guy >> @benwerd https://github.com/idno/idno/commits/master way 2 go @withknown keep pluggin on #indieweb
(twitter.com/_/status/513745383659278336)
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GWG
What's going on?
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bret
working on twitter posse
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GWG
bret: How so?
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bret
when I post a note via micropub with a syndicate-to field set, I want it to actually land on twitter ^_^ (right now it does nothing)
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bret
I have syndication option disovery working though: http://bret.io/2014/09/21/now-i-just-have-to-m/
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GWG
bret: I just can't get the formattig up
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bret
GWG not sure what you mean?
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bret
would be cool to do a mobile twitter client api -> micropub client, via the API root url. wonder how far along shaners got on that
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GWG
bret: I have trouble getting the Twitter output to be consistent with the software I'm using, to the point I'm writing a Bridgy Publish plugin for Wordpress to add in the publish URL and send the mention so it will POSSE for me
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bret
oh hrmmm. Yeah not sure how I am going to deal with format inconstancies. I'm going to avoid using bridy publish as I already have gitpub
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@theindieweb
Due to lack of experience in the domain, we are going to be shutting down our blog. Thank you to those who supported. Go IndieWeb!
(twitter.com/_/status/513748652582768640)
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kylewm
GWG: sorry if you already know, but you don't actually have to have the link to bridgy publish in your post, you can just send a webmention without a backlink
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GWG
That changed? Good to know
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kylewm
(i'm not sure it's such a good idea for bridgy to allow that, as someone could "maliciously" post your posts to social media)
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GWG
kylewm: I'll be doing it with a publish URL for my own safety then
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kylewm
huh, too bad theindieweb.com is shutting down
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bret
who ran that?
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kylewm
not sure
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bret
we could totally use more people to help document stuff
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bret
which twitter API do people use for twitter posse?
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kylewm
Bridgy uses Tweepy; I just use requests-oauthlib and the http API
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bret
can I use the streaming api for POSSE?
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kylewm
bret: streaming API is read-only I'm pretty sure
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bear
bret - if you use python-twitter you get free support from one of the contributors for life
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bret
:) thanks bear
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bear
but yea, both will do the job for posse
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@davidbgk
> The database antipattern is the use of a db for primary long-term storage of posts and other personal content — http://indiewebcamp.com/database-antipattern
(twitter.com/_/status/513763885053382657)
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@ScottWNesbitt
RT @dangillmor: Want to understand IndieWeb better? See this (no sound) animation: https://www.youtube.com/
(twitter.com/_/status/513771433571258369)
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bret
twitter api is kind of confusing :/
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@DodgerWA
RT @danlyke: .@poachable I'd go out of my way to support and even champion any company which used personal URL/IndieWeb/micro formats profi…
(twitter.com/_/status/513778774433755136)
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kylewm.com
edited /User:Tantek.com (+287) "/* RelMeAuth PHP library */ note my pull request hoping to fix this"
(view diff)
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kylewm
bret: anything in particular?06
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bret
just deciding how to do the oauth dace
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bret
il should just make the good part work, and fix that later
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bret
(POSEE being the good part and just manually generate keys)
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parzzix
kylewm, redwind uses sqlite?
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kylewm
parzzix: it does right now, i may or may not migrate to postgres eventually
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parzzix
kylewm
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parzzix
kylewm opps....thanks
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kylewm
bret: did you find an oauth library for node?
tallpaul, alexhart_, petermolnar, krendil and KevinMarks_ joined the channel
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KevinMarks_
Noterlive just uses the OAuth library in node
alanpearce and wolftune joined the channel
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bret
kylewm there are some twitter libs in node I was testing out
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bret
KevinMarks_ did you figure out your noter live troubles?
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KevinMarks_
Yes, I had checked in a stale npm_modules that was confusing things, and putting it in .ignore wasn't enough
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KevinMarks_
Had to explicitly nuke it
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KevinMarks_
Try it out noterlive.com
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bret
KevinMarks++ that looks awesome!
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Loqi
KevinMarks has 57 karma
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KevinMarks_
Kylewm++ for pointing out my mistake
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Loqi
Kylewm has 55 karma
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bret
KevinMarks a decent git ignore for node: https://github.com/bcomnes/gitpub/blob/master/.gitignore
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KevinMarks_
The server side bit of noterlive is pretty simple https://github.com/kevinmarks/noterlive/blob/master/web.js
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bret
Is it cool that consumerSecret is public?
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@singh_gurjeet
RT @robtreat2: RT @papa_fire: This has got to be an elaborate trolling, otherwise all is lost for this industry http://indiewebcamp.com/database-antipattern
(twitter.com/_/status/513801815499231232)
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@JCCPalmer
The Internet: "Humanity's Greatest Invention" http://jpalmer.withknown.com/2014/humanitys-greatest-invention #indieweb #InternetRights
(twitter.com/_/status/513802516840988672)
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@puppet_ebooks
Indieweb: WE ARE YOU UP here, this indie web. lol
(twitter.com/_/status/513803875967827968)
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bret
whut
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Loqi
tantek: KartikPrabhu left you a message 5 hours, 19 minutes ago: add yourself to /file-storage ?
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GWG
What's going on?
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GWG
People still making an issue out of databases?
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tantek
GWG, people who collect Cargo Cult habits respond emotionally to having their assumptions questioned.
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tantek.com
edited /file-storage (+521) "add self to IndieWeb example, rm blank criticism until there is actual real world"
(view diff)
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GWG
tantek: I just don't see how it is an Indieweb issue.
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GWG
I own my content if I run a database server
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GWG
Me not running a database server is in the same category as Wordpress vs Known vs Redwind...
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tantek
GWG it's an indieweb issue because self-maintained web sites are particularly sensitive to admin tax
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bear.im
edited /file-storage (+293) "add bear.im to list"
(view diff)
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GWG
It's certainly a valuable conversation.
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GWG
I'm not disagreeing with that.
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GWG
What is admin tax?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "admin tax" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=admin+tax
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bear
the ironic part in all of this is that they bitch about indieweb not being diverse but yet bitch when we try to show how to do things as simple as possible so it *CAN BE DONE* by non-technical folks using just an editor
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GWG
bear: I agree with that point as well.
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bear
flags himself for being in a foul mood and wanders off to literally cool off as errands outside have taken their due
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bear.im
edited /file-storage (+17) "add starting date - 2003-12-18"
(view diff)
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GWG
I find the idea of flat file storage interesting, but am not ready to go in that direction.
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bear
like all design decisions, you have to weight the costs and go with what works for you
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tantek.com
created /DBA_tax (+42) "r"
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tantek.com
created /admin_tax (+437) "stub since GWG asked"
(view diff)
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GWG
tantek: Would you add to that...adding new features?
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GWG
In your opinion, is that an applicable example?
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GWG
Or would that be something else?
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GWG
I know I've commented in here on developing more than content creation
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tantek
bear: ignore the cargo cultists - they will never innovate anything. Cargo cultists are by definition copiers, followers, immitators of things they don't understand nor how to question them and do better.
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bear
nods
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bear
working on it
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tantek
they are good at a couple of things however: posting tweets and emails.
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bear.im
edited /file-storage (+14) "/* Bear */"
(view diff)
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tantek
GWG add what to adding new features?
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GWG
tantek: Does adding new features to your personal site rather than using it fall under the definition of admin tax?
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tantek
GWG more like development tax ;)
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tantek
rather than admin
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GWG
What is development tax?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "development tax" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=development+tax
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GWG
I'm on it
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tantek
it *is* a tax of sorts, above and beyond simply *using* an existing already developed solution/project
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KartikPrabhu
GWG: I hae doing a "syncdb" everytime I add something to my database. Presumably (I hope) in a file storage it can be done by simply adding a new field to the test file through a text editor
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: is this true for Falcon Storage ? ^
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bear.im
edited /file-storage (-15) "/* Bear */"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: neat. So if one day you have to add a "new field" you just add it in BBedit and it works yes?
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tantek
correct
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tantek
that's the nice thing about markup - you never have to "alter table"
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KartikPrabhu
see that is the comparison to make. a fully working file storage with a fully working DB. Not a "ooo I have to make folders and files" with a full-fledged MySQL
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bear
that is both an advantage and an eventual curse for flat file storage with static generation - you re-read almost everything to generate the site, so adding new things is easy
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david.shanske.com
created /development_tax (+460) "Created page with "{{stub}} '''<dfn>development tax</dfn>''' is all the time you spend <em>development</em> the software that runs your personal site, rather than actually <em>using</em> it (like ...""
(view diff)
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bear
but even that problem (the loading of the entire site) is solvable with some coding
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GWG
KartikPrabhu: I see the point, but I'm still not convinced. But if anyone wants a flat file database..I'm for it for them
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KartikPrabhu
GWG: the convincing thing is up to you, your use case and tastes. The good thing is for the indieweb to work today, we don't really care what your backend is!
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GWG
KartikPrabhu: That is what I like
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GWG
Especially since I know there are a lot of comments on my backed
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GWG
backend
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KartikPrabhu
and that is what these "wars" don't understand. pardon my French but no one gives a flying-fuck what you use, if your website works
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tantek
KartikPrabhu: which question(s)?
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KartikPrabhu
"Isn't flat-files a form of database? " and "How is this related to the indieweb? " to an FAQ section in /file-storage
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GWG
KartikPrabhu: I'll drink to that...if I drank
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tantek
KartikPrabhu: it's a religious war - not rational - hence http://youtu.be/gb_qHP7VaZE
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tantek
KartikPrabhu: it was asked in the context of /database-antipattern so it belongs there
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tantek
both of them
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tantek
so I'd leave them ehre
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GWG
Cross reference?
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: I lol at your video
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tantek.com
created /User:Www.techfox.co.uk (+73) "stub with an h-card"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /2014/UK (+167) "add Blog Posts section, trim extra cruft"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /code-of-conduct-examples (+72) "/* Examples */ dConstruct 2014 Code of conduct"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /2014/UK (+81) "/* Blog Posts */ adactio Switching to https"
(view diff)
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tantek
I'm wondering if we should document "cargo cult programming" as a phenomenon
#
tantek
and cite these purely emotional responses as evidence thereof
#
tantek
the cargo-cult-antipattern ;)
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: would that worsen the situation though? more flame wars
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tantek
The answer to flame wars is to document them rationally and let history judge them accordingly.
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tantek
The documentation will continue until the flaming stops.
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tantek.com
edited /2014/UK (+84) "/* Blog Posts */ adactio Indie Web Camp UK 2014"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /User:Retout.co.uk (+63) "add h-card"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
created /Go (+185) "stub with dfn, see also"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: possibly. just thinking that indiewebcamp might not need more "wars" at the moment
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tantek.com
edited /Craft (+12) "linky linky"
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tantek.com
created /CMS (+39) "r"
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tantek.com
created /content_management_system (+280) "stub with dfn, short list, see also"
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tantek.com
created /transmat (+42) "r"
(view diff)
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@BillSeitz
.@kartik_prabhu @joeld @kyle_wm I feel like you still need a BlogComment system, so WebMention-s is double work. http://webseitz.fluxent.com/wiki/BlogThread
(twitter.com/_/status/513827659563147265)
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tantek.com
edited /2014/UK/Demos (+320) "expand see also subsection with list of both Kevin and my posts"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /User:Kevinbeynon.com (+252) "add participant in UK quote from Twitter"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
segue webmention to backfeed :P
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@BillSeitz
@kartik_prabhu @joeld @kyle_wm How does someone without a blog make a comment of more than 140chars?
(twitter.com/_/status/513829649164423168)
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tantek.com
edited /reply-thread (+364) "resort a bit, preferring indieweb, why (add a why reason), note markup conventions not yet determined"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
for reference: this https://twitter.com/joeld/status/513699407129505792 is turning out to be quite a fruitful "why indieweb discussion". Civilised and with good questions being asked
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@joeld
.@gRegorLove? RT @BillSeitz: @joeld @davextreme @manton any visible examples of back-and-forth BlogThread using WebMention? #OpenTwitter
(twitter.com/_/status/513699407129505792)
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kylewm
KartikPrabhu: I was thinking he had OverCapitalization syndrome before I realized it's wiki wordsi
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KartikPrabhu
ha yeah me too
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GWG
Can't we all just get along? Regardless of race, religion, or web platform?