#indiewebcamp 2014-09-05

2014-09-05 UTC
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KevinMarks_ bret: is that much of a pivot for known?
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bret lol no not really ;)
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benwerd bret: just saw your message. The reader is such an important piece of this puzzle.
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bret are you working on one?
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benwerd Yes
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bret :D
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benwerd It's coming soon, and Kevin's right, it's more of an extrapolation than a pivot ;)
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benwerd First: demo days. But it'll be coming soon. For us it also solves the blank page problem of, "ok, so now what do I do with this empty site I just created?"
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benwerd I mean, as well as being a complete evolution of the way we'll use social media. Obvs.
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bret benwerd++ I was mostly just kidding around since you are basically already doing that
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Loqi benwerd has 34 karma
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mko In case anybody here has ever used Twitpic before, they're shutting down on September 25th and will be giving you the ability to export your data: http://blog.twitpic.com/2014/09/twitpic-is-shutting-down/
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bret ohh thats a big site death
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mko Yeah.
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KevinMarks_ more of a site murder, given that twitter is making them do it
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bret just change the name and keep the domain running
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bret twitter is really turning up the suck knob recently
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mowens.com edited /site-deaths (+593) "/* Adds TwitPic to the Upcoming Site Deaths section. */" (view diff)
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KevinMarks_ changing the domain name would still break all the old links
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rascul http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/twitpic-shutting-down-over-twitter-trademark-dispute-1.2755932?
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kylewm the spokesman said. "We encourage developers to build on top of the Twitter service, as Twitpic has done for years, and we made it clear that they could operate using the Twitpic name. Of course, we also have to protect our brand, and that includes trademarks tied to the brand."
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kylewm (from the article rascul linked)
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kylewm I don't understand the weird hedge at the end
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kylewm yeah that statement could have been much less ambiguous
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rascul https://www.nc.me/ free .me for students
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kylewm (I get it now, they're not demanding Twitpic stop calling themselves that but that they abandon their trademark application)
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rascul i would be interested to know more about why twitter doesn't like their trademark application
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KevinMarks Wish they'd mentioned that free .me before I bought one last week
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GWG Are you a student?
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GWG KevinMarks, you going to talk about the Indieweb next week?
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@JosephRooks @davemorin @jayrosen_nyu @dhh Or… support development of better decentralized tools for publishing and connecting people? #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/507727821469646848)
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kylewm uggggh https://twitter.com/dhh/status/507719046008430593
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@dhh Wonder how much it would cost to run a Twitter-like service as a non-profit charity, like Firefox or Wikipedia? (twitter.com/_/status/507719046008430593)
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kylewm and Jeff Atwood graciously changed it from Standard to Common Markdown ... which just seems exceptionally petulant
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KevinMarks Gwg my son is a student
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GWG KevinMarks: That works.
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GWG I just pull out my old student ID
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KevinMarks Talk about indieweb on TWiG you mean?
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GWG KevinMarks: Yes. I listen to it on my commute
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KevinMarks He now has ChristopherMarks.me
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GWG I enjoy the rants of Jeff Jarvis.
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KevinMarks Hoping to go on with Ben and Erin next week
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GWG Well, I'll tune in, most likely not live
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KevinMarks Seriously, Anil? Check out @anildash's Tweet: https://twitter.com/anildash/status/507736528773451777
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@anildash Spoiler: @gruber & @davewiner were right. The shiftiness of their formats doesn't matter, the utility of them does. RSS & Markdown work. (twitter.com/_/status/507736528773451777)
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benwerd Would markdown matter if wysiwyg html editors actually worked?
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bear for people who have to deal with the raw data - yes
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Loqi bear: tantek left you a message on 9/2 at 10:55pm: I've updated my site to fully to level 2 as documented on /https and documented the "how to"s of what I got working here: https://indiewebcamp.com/https#Level_2_security (please review and point out any flaws in my changes)
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kylewm i'm not sure i've ever used a wysiwyg editor, for anything, that worked as well as i wanted it to
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Nadreck “Have to” is relative. At this point I actually miss having markup even when I’m in a Word or RTF doc. I’m pretty sure I’m not the target audience of wysiwyg editors, though.
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KevinMarks Wysiwyg has always been a mixed blessing
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KevinMarks And as the markdown babel tool shows, you get a lot of randomness out of markdown
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KevinMarks They should call it markup and move on
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KevinMarks So markdown doesn't allow img tags?
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KevinMarks I have Google domains invitations if anyone wants one
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GWG What are the features of that again?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "the features of that again" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=the+features+of+that+again
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GWG I just wonder if they will stay in that business.
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@hmans @dhh Well, I've built a distributed Twitter-ish thing using open indieweb standards, using Rails, and not requiring a Kickstarter. It works. (twitter.com/_/status/507776102123962368)
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@hmans @dhh It uses the very simple Webmention protocol at its core, embraces all things HTTP. https://github.com/hmans/pants (twitter.com/_/status/507778424522690560)
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benwerd I sincerely love that when I discover a new indieweb implementation, I know I can already reply to their posts etc
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benwerd How it should be.
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tantek_ sad about twitpic
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tantek_ curious/funny about the markdown debates
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tantek_ what is markdown?
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Loqi Markdown is a way of writing and interpreting plain text so that it can optionally be converted to more explicitly meaningful or richly styled text (e.g http://indiewebcamp.com/markdown
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neuro` Good morning.
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@fdevillamil Pants is a distributed, open source (micro)blogging service built with Rails and using webmention. Worth checking. http://pants.social/ (twitter.com/_/status/507793614085189632)
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@pathsny @NBomb @arcadiy there is a project called indieweb which is about a bunch of different specs around open implementations of familiar ideas (twitter.com/_/status/507797229650722816)
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@BarnabyWalters Posting my first note over HTTPS, #taproot now at http://indiewebcamp.com/https level to with a self-signed… https://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/4Xy8TZ/ (twitter.com/_/status/507807250858000384)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/twitter/BarnabyWalters/507807250858000384/507808294065299456 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/https (webmention)
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www.hitono.info edited /projects (+60) "/* Jekyll */ added my page to list of users" (view diff)
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@Keltounet RT @fdevillamil: Pants is a distributed, open source (micro)blogging service built with Rails and using webmention. Worth checking. http://… (twitter.com/_/status/507823071500460032)
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@hmans Most failures were #pants trying to send webmentions to non-URLs (eg. footnote links). Will be fixed. (twitter.com/_/status/507849603778351104)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/twitter/ShaneHudson/507602941306339328/507603256202100736 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/ (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/twitter/ShaneHudson/507602941306339328/507603505196969985 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/ (webmention)
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@t Today's @dConstruct "Living With The Network" talks are providing superb inspiration for @IndieWebCampUK this weekend. (ttk.me t4Xy1) (twitter.com/_/status/507859930515529728)
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@snickn RT @fdevillamil: Pants is a distributed, open source (micro)blogging service built with Rails and using webmention. Worth checking. http://… (twitter.com/_/status/507861999712468992)
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@badgermind RT @t: Today's @dConstruct "Living With The Network" talks are providing superb inspiration for @IndieWebCampUK this weekend. (ttk.me t4Xy1) (twitter.com/_/status/507862047934414848)
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Loqi [mention] https://selfstarter.pt/indiewebifying-wordpress-part-0/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://selfstarter.pt/indiewebifying-wordpress-part-0/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://selfstarter.pt/indiewebifying-wordpress-part-0/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://selfstarter.pt/indiewebifying-wordpress-part-0/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/backfeed (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://selfstarter.pt/indiewebifying-wordpress-part-0/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/permalinks (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://selfstarter.pt/indiewebifying-wordpress-part-0/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/wordpress (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://selfstarter.pt/indiewebifying-wordpress-part-0/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/indiemark (webmention)
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Loqi Welcome, indie-visitor! Set your nickname by typing /nick yourname
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@alexgspiers RT @benwerd: Farewell, #twitpic. Many photos lost. Yet another reason why it's better to share from a site that you control. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/507868541996236801)
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@mdvfunes @ShaneHudson Hi, Shane. Is it possible to attend online this weekend? near BN but cannot make @IndieWebCampUK asked them but no response yet (twitter.com/_/status/507877842529820672)
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@ShaneHudson @mdvfunes @IndieWebCampUK it should be, give @t a shout :) (twitter.com/_/status/507878393002885120)
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tantrk_ hello from Taylor street Batista's
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@jamierelay Just saw indieweb for the first time - interesting approach that goes beyond federation and decentralization: http://indiewebcamp.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/507878987679293441)
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tantek_ let's see if this works now
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pdurbin tantek_: you have some good points about markdown is nicely inspired by plain text email but has some odd syntax one rarely sees in plain text email: http://irclog.perlgeek.de/crimsonfu/2014-09-05#i_9302537
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iamdanw1 Ello
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@stevebanfield RT @fdevillamil: Pants is a distributed, open source (micro)blogging service built with Rails and using webmention. Worth checking. http://… (twitter.com/_/status/507883245120155648)
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@wisecrack03 For a mix of fun indie projects like https://www.facebook.com/jessandyent #indie #indiefilm #writing #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/507884929704001536)
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@vmarks @jayrosen_nyu @superpixels being back the indieweb. Cc/ @kevinmarks (twitter.com/_/status/507886182450352128)
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@hmans RT @fdevillamil: Pants is a distributed, open source (micro)blogging service built with Rails and using webmention. Worth checking. http://… (twitter.com/_/status/507890921279868928)
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Loqi [mention] http://hmans.io/qjz760 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/ (webmention)
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@davidmead Not your problem @aaronpk I know, but have you've heard of Wordpress 4 breaking broadcasting? Mine stopped to Twitter. /cc @t #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/507894752839491584)
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@t Already excited about the personal-site demos I have heard will be shown @IndieWebCampUK. #selfdogfood #showbeforetell (ttk.me t4Xy2) (twitter.com/_/status/507897534296379394)
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tantek thanks pdurbin!
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tantek it's fascinating to watch the Markdown debates
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tantek perhaps the time is right to ultra-simplify and minimize Markdown, back to its founding principles
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@kevinmarks “I’m down with this retro movement. Bring back personal blogs… Bring back the fun. Screw Big Internet.” http://www.roughtype.com/?p=5010 #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/507898290650632193)
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KevinMarks_ i like the empiricism of the markdown babel tool
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KevinMarks_ but surveying published markdown would be good (if slightly tricky, as it would be github centric)
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tantek KevinMarks: it's too bad that empiricism was not applied to the source material - email/usenet plain text
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tantek without that - Markdown will inevitably evolve into just yet another arcane wiki-like syntax
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KevinMarks_ it has already imo
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KevinMarks_ your point about images is good , though you should add svg
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KevinMarks_ also <img> is not on the blessed HTML tag list
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tantek neither is <time>
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tantek quite a bit of obvious omission in said "blessed HTML tag list"
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KevinMarks_ https://twitter.com/gruber/status/507669745496522752
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KevinMarks_ is a good sentiment
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tantek indeed. that was similarly I think how we thought about microformats to begin with.
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tantek though I'm pretty sure we have improved *all* of those (readability, writeability, parsability, implementability) with microformats2
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tantek just goes to show, sometimes it's not "pick 2" (of 3-4 asserted optimization points)
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tantek good afternoon :)
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ben_thatmustbeme good here, working on url shortener
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ben_thatmustbeme then i'll just have to figure out how to get bridgy to use the shortened urls not the full ones
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ben_thatmustbeme yay, it works
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ben_thatmustbeme 'btmb.me/s/e' will redirect to 'http://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2014/9/3/1/note'
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kylewm what's the significance of /s/e ?
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ben_thatmustbeme s = shortener e = 17 (i think) in base 60, which is the ID of the record
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ben_thatmustbeme also leaves /<some other letter>/ open for redirects to any pages that are not just posts
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ben_thatmustbeme posts/notes/articles/photos what have you
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ben_thatmustbeme no, thats 39 actually
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ben_thatmustbeme http://tantek.pbworks.com/w/page/19402946/NewBase60
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kylewm ben_thatmustbeme: makes sense, have you considered dropping the / in between?
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ben_thatmustbeme hmm, i suppose I could, but this way actually works in to my code better, /s/ tells it the controller (looks it up in a routes file) goes to the /blog/shortener controller and knows to pass encoded_id = e
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ben_thatmustbeme the sacrifice of a single character is worth it to me
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kylewm.com edited /sandstorm (+126) "/* Crowdfunding */ campaign ended successfully" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme actually kylewm, its probably unsafe to remove the /. I just looked in to that and was going to change it to p (post) instead of s (short)
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ben_thatmustbeme but something like /post become confusing is it p&eid='ost' or is it just post controller
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kylewm ben_thatmustbeme: so the way I handle that is redirect from kyl.im/post to kylewm.com/short/post, so it's unambiguous
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ben_thatmustbeme i could have done that, but i didn't want to add another redirect in the layer
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ben_thatmustbeme ben.thatmustbe.me/s/e is actually the same exact code as btmb.me/s/e, which will just kick back a redirect to the correct page
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kylewm.com edited /sandstorm (+849) "/* Technology */ add some detail to the Technology section based on CenturyLink podcast interview" (view diff)
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kylewm Loqi, you snoozing?
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kylewm neuro`: I'd love to try your container when it's ready
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tantek.com edited /new (+18) "redir" (view diff)
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tantek neuro` great! or you can ask the channel
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tantek what is new?
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kylewm I'm trying to decide whether I should try to speed up my application logic or slap a cache on the whole thing
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tantek let's try that again
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tantek what is new?
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Loqi Welcome to news about the indieweb where recent notable articles about the indieweb are cited and linked to keep you up to date http://indiewebcamp.com/new
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@aaronpk @mdvfunes @ShaneHudson @IndieWebCampUK Yes! You can even RSVP as a remote participant! http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK/Guest_List#Remote_Participants (twitter.com/_/status/507925680244269056)
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Loqi [mention] http://aaronparecki.com/replies/2014/09/05/1/indiewebcamp linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK/Guest_List#Remote_Participants (webmention)
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aaronpk wondering if we should open up the web IRC chat to remote participants for this weekend
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@IndieWebCampUK RT @aaronpk: @mdvfunes @ShaneHudson @IndieWebCampUK Yes! You can even RSVP as a remote participant! http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK/Guest_List#Remote_Participants (twitter.com/_/status/507926411014049792)
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@aaronpk @davidmead Haven't heard of anyone using Wordpress 4.0 with the #indieweb plugins yet, but come by and chat! http://indiewebcamp.com/IRC (twitter.com/_/status/507927192039206912)
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Loqi [mention] http://aaronparecki.com/replies/2014/09/05/2/indieweb linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/IRC (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/repost/twitter/aaronpk/507925680244269056/507926411014049792 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK/Guest_List#Remote_Participants (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/aaronpk/507925680244269056/785475632 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK/Guest_List#Remote_Participants (webmention)
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snarfed ben_thatmust: re your q about bridgy, did you mean, you'd want bridgy publish to include your short url in the tweet it posts, instead of the full one?
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ben_thatmustbeme correct
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snarfed that should work now. just plug your short url into the url text box instead of the full url
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snarfed (or if you're publishing via webmention, use your short url as the source)
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snarfed i'll add a faq for that now
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ben_thatmustbeme cool, thats what I was hoping. I just need to update the webmention code to do that
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ben_thatmustbeme again, i'm using mention-client-php to do that so i may need to look in to that
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/twitter/aaronpk/507927192039206912/507929663146975232 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/IRC (webmention)
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@benwerd Why can't you comment on this post? #indieweb http://werd.io/2014/why-cant-you-comment-on-this-post-indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/507932738528083968)
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@benwerd @KateMfD @dogtrax Sorry for the confusion. I wrote a post about this: http://werd.io/2014/why-cant-you-comment-on-this-post-indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/507933130766815232)
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aaronpk benwerd: some people definitely expect to see a comment box
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benwerd Yes - really want to add one
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benwerd And thinking that we should have one before the release
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benwerd Wrote that as a conversation starter
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aaronpk I wonder if there's a friendly version of a webmention form we could put in the location people expect the comment box to be
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aaronpk ha this is great https://twitter.com/KateMfD/status/507831078367686656
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@KateMfD @dogtrax @jimgroom We'll wait awhile and @withknown will come along and help, I just Know it. (twitter.com/_/status/507831078367686656)
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aaronpk followed by your reply :)
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benwerd They've realized (rightly) that they can mention us and we'll show up to help :)
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aaronpk I do like the "have you written a response to this?" prompt http://aaron.pk/n4Xx2
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aaronpk but it's not quite obvious enough for people I think
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KartikPrabhu morning!
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benwerd aaronpk: I think that's good, but the reality is that a lot of people will have written a response on, eg, Facebook if they've written one at all. Native comments are handy
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snarfed benwerd++ it's an individual choice each person can make for their own site, but i get a steady stream of native comments that i appreciate. high signal to noise (assuming you use a spam filter)
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Loqi benwerd has 35 karma
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snarfed i expect most are from people without web sites, so a webmention form wouldn't work for them
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davidmead hi aaronpk
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davidmead saw the link in twitter. wanted to chat about indieweb plugins in Wordpress 4 not working
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snarfed davidmead: which plugins?
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snarfed have you looked at their support forums?
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davidmead snarfed: looks like ‘Social’ by mailchimp isn’t broadcasting to Twitter
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snarfed davidmead: ok. it started right when you upgraded to wp 4?
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davidmead snarfed: i did. says it hasn’t been tested with the current version (that looks like an auto msg). Yeah. Upgraded this morning and didn’t post
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snarfed davidmead: ok. you may be ahead of other social users here. maybe post to the support forum? http://wordpress.org/support/plugin/social
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davidmead snarfed: Ah. OK. I was checking with aaronpk on twitter in case anyone else had experienced trouble.
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aaronpk hey davidmead! yeah I don't have much experience with wordpress, but several others here do
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davidmead snarfed: i’ll drop them a msg in the forum. It’s pulling in replies from twitter. Just the post seems to be broken
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snarfed davidmead: btw, how do you like social's support for pulling back replies?
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snarfed (i run a similar service, http://brid.gy/ , so i'm always interested in "competitors" :P)
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davidmead snarfed: I like it. Haven’t tried yours, but more than willing to try it :-)
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snarfed davidmead: thanks! no need though, if you like social stick with it.
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snarfed does it pull back favorites and retweets too?
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aaronpk "alternatives" :)
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snarfed frenemies
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benwerd Interesting. Mailchimp Social has come up a bunch of times with users asking about differentiation.
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davidmead snarfed: i think so. seems the display is borked in my comments too http://davidjohnmead.com/2014/09/05/the-future-of-a-twitter-alternative/comment-page-1/#comment-1636
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snarfed davidmead: yeah, interop and display details for some tweets are tricky. we've been thinking about this here too
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davidmead snarfed: also hpping between web and Wordpress app causes some hassle when relying etc.
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snarfed (tl;dr: if someone *else* tweets a link to your post, and someone favorites it, should we send that favorite back to your post? how should it display? etc. more discussion here: https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/51 )
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davidmead aaronpk: hey :-) thanks anyway
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snarfed benwerd: yup, i consistently hear that social is good software
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benwerd nods. I need to spend some quality time with it.
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davidmead snarfed: it’s a plus to see those interactions, for me at least.
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snarfed davidmead: oh sure! the question is how to display them. if the tweet about your post is negative, and someone favorites that tweet, we probably shouldn't show that they "favorited" your post. i think we don't yet know how to display that at all, really
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snarfed (also, i definitely don't plan to do sentiment analysis to even try to distinguish positive from negative tweets :P)
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davidmead snarfed: hmm, i see. in that particular case someone is favoriting a “mention” of your post. not the post itself. maybe nesting it under the negatice response would be the way to go
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snarfed davidmead: sure…but then we get into the sentiment analysis rathole. i don't see many examples of categorizing positive vs negative, apart from explicit "like" etc.
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snarfed that way lie dragons
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bret how does sentiment analysis work?
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aaronpk it doesn't usually
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snarfed :P
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snarfed i actually built a toy sentiment analysis engine in school, way back in maybe 1999ish. https://snarfed.org/ryan.barrett.name/nlp/
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snarfed oh man, memories
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ben_thatmustbeme ahh, hmm, i see bridgy is posting the title to twitter, its not shortening the text, I am. hmmmm
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aaronpk snarfed: oh wow. that was a while ago.
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bret dang, neato!
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bret snarfed: are you mostly looking for keywords?
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snarfed bret: no clue. it was 15y ago, so i've forgotten it entirely
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snarfed looking at https://snarfed.org/ryan.barrett.name/nlp/slide4.html , there were a bunch of features, not just keywords
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davidmead snarfed: just signed up with brid.gy - As I already had the IndieWeb plugin installed it polled & pulled right away. Nice :-) Just saw a (duplicated to Social) tweet show up in the comments.
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davidmead snarfed: i’ll disable Social until/if it gets a fix.
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snarfed davidmead: great! yeah, if you're already pulling back with social, i wouldn't recommend using both at the same time.
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snarfed if you like social's backfeed though, you can keep using it, and only use bridgy to publish. up to you
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davidmead snarfed: now to broadcast to I post on my blog, then got to https://www.brid.gy/twitter/davidmead to publish? or does it do it straight from my WP blog?
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snarfed davidmead: not straight from wp. you'd need to go to that page, or include a magic invisible link in your post to do it automatically. details: https://www.brid.gy/about#publish
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KevinMarks__ Sentiment analysis is what every person who did a cs nlp course writes
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snarfed KevinMarks++
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Loqi KevinMarks has 50 karma
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KevinMarks__ It tends to fail horribly at any kind of nuance or sarcasm
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snarfed (we didn't know to call it sentiment analysis back then, but otherwise yup)
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KevinMarks__ If I was doing one now I'd just look for smileys and emoticons
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KevinMarks__ But the cs nlp people all filter out punctuation and case
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snarfed we used emoticons and punctuation!
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snarfed but ours was still just a toy, not industrial strength
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KevinMarks__ I meant emoji
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snarfed oh god yeah
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ben_thatmustbeme hahah, nice, it works!
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snarfed fortunately they didn't really exist 15y ago
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Loqi nice
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KevinMarks__ Most of the "industrial strength" ones are fragile too.
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ben_thatmustbeme Posse with my new URL shortener to twitter
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snarfed KevinMarks__: oh definitely
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snarfed ben_thatmust: nice!
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KevinMarks__ We can't even agree what fav means
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davidmead snarfed: great. i’ll play more at the weekend :-) thanks for the help.
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@68MiddleSt It's @IndieWebCampUK here @68MiddleSt tomorrow! Yay! http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/507949286915461120)
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kylewm.com edited /User:Kylewm.com (+421) "added Need Help With section w/ Performance bullet point" (view diff)
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bret btw https://ngrok.com is super duper handy
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bret where should I put another local tunnel tool on the wiki?
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aaronpk do we already have https://localtunnel.me/ ?
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bret i like ngrok better
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bret i have had lots of problems with localtunnel.me
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@kevinmarks @pamelafox we use http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=indiewebcamp&nick=indie-visitor (twitter.com/_/status/507952195346501632)
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GWG Just deployed Version 3 of my Site Theme...going to iterate and fix live.
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GWG Anyone want to give me an opinion?
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@voxpelli @qzio Depends, the ones that dig deep into focused issues brings people from afar. Eg the @IndieWebCampUK I'm at now is pretty international (twitter.com/_/status/507955471748456448)
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ben_thatmustbeme GWG, the gray below and to the right of the banner irks me :P Also the social icons aren't quite centered, which stuck out to me.
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ben_thatmustbeme I like the menu bar, very nice. I don't know what it was before
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GWG Centered in the bar?
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GWG The bar was thinner.
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GWG It's a rewritten and cleaned up version of the previous one. Still needs some tweaking.
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ben_thatmustbeme no i mean the icons within their containing boxes. The look a little high.
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GWG But I couldn't check it on the test site
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GWG High? They are centered within the box?
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ben_thatmustbeme the facebook icon i think is most noticeable for that
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ben_thatmustbeme they don't look centered to me
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GWG I am trying to see it.
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GWG I know about the space around the header.
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aaronpk lol I love people clicking the link from kevinmarks' tweet which drops them into the IRC room
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ben_thatmustbeme GWG my rendering: http://students.cs.uri.edu/~ben/cropped.png
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GWG Weird.
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GWG What browser?
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ben_thatmustbeme FF
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GWG On Firefox, I see it
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GWG On Chrome, I don't.
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GWG Odd
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GWG Need to figure out why.
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voxpelli_ One often have a problem aligning stuff inline vertically in both FF and WebKit/Chrome
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GWG I'll figure it out
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voxpelli_ Less line-height more padding should do it
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GWG I also have to go make some fixes I already made on the previous version
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GWG I always forget things on rewrites.
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GWG But first...lunch
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@anderiasch RT @fdevillamil: Pants is a distributed, open source (micro)blogging service built with Rails and using webmention. Worth checking. http://… (twitter.com/_/status/507960619912658945)
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@dissolve333 Sad to see Twitpic fall? Tired of losing everything? Try the #indieweb and keep your data yourself. Posted on… (http://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2014/9/5/3/_) (twitter.com/_/status/507961565962711041)
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ben_thatmustbeme it worked
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ben_thatmustbeme huh, Loqi goes down redirects first
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Loqi is done
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aaronpk yeah Loqi expands all redirects til the end
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aaronpk otherwise it'd just show a bunch of bit.ly links after expanding the t.co link
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ben_thatmustbeme very true
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /OpenBlog (+146) "updated currect features list." (view diff)
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kevinmarks.com edited /2014/UK/Guest_List (+303) "/* Remote Participants */" (view diff)
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pdurbin tantek_: it is a bit fascinating. I like this tweet: James Deacon on Twitter: "Kid builds castle. Other kid says 'hey, you've done it wrong, get out the way and let me show you what your castle should be' #Markdown" - https://twitter.com/JamesDeacon/status/507683360173731840
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@JamesDeacon Kid builds castle. Other kid says 'hey, you've done it wrong, get out the way and let me show you what your castle should be' #Markdown (twitter.com/_/status/507683360173731840)
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pdurbin and this is good: http://scripting.com/2014/09/05/emailToGruber.html
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KevinMarks_ so, if Andrew is coming to indiewebcamp UK and he has a known site, should he be my apprentice?
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KevinMarks_ or does he count as a creator?
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gRegor` I thought it was just "Participants" now on /2014/UK/Guest_List
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gRegor` (and going forward)
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KevinMarks_ there is still apprentice language there
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KevinMarks_ and 3 apprentices
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GWG Anyone know anything about the picture html5 tag?
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ben_thatmustbeme not much, just the article i read recently. sounded like a wrapper around multiple <img> tags
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@michaellimiero @zwaldowski I like what these guys are doing http://indiewebcamp.com/ Not trying to write a Facebook-killer, just building cool stuff. (twitter.com/_/status/507970187292073984)
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GWG ben_thatmustbeme, that is it. Thinking of using it. There is a js library for unsupported browsers
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KartikPrabhu ben_thatmustbeme: it isn't a wrapper around multiple <img>s. there is one <img> for fallback
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ben_thatmustbeme ahh, that makes more sense
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pdurbin GWG: they talked about it at http://shoptalkshow.com/episodes/125-rapid-fire-33/
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Garbee GWG, Picturefill
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GWG The more I play with development, the more I realize what I don't know
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Garbee http://scottjehl.github.com/picturefill/
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GWG Garbee, I know
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KartikPrabhu GWG: ben_thatmustbeme: https://longhandpixels.net/blog/2014/02/complete-guide-picture-element is good
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Garbee oh, whoops. I switch "there" and "is" in your statement.
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Garbee Yea, go ahead and use it.
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Garbee It is shipping in Chrome 38 and soon in Firefox too.
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GWG I found someone who wrote code I can learn from that uses the WordPress featured image system to generate the sizes.
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Garbee And Safari is in the works. Just IE is left out so far.
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Garbee http://status.modern.ie/pictureelement?term=picture
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kevinmarks.com edited /2014/UK/Guest_List (+457) "/* Participants */" (view diff)
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GWG I just changed my site theme and I'm fixing some issues.
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@danlyke Torn between Chimera North Bay tech meet and SF IndieWeb next Wednesday. IndieWeb is currently winning. (twitter.com/_/status/507975215218192384)
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Loqi [mention] http://gregorlove.com/notes/2014/09/05/1/ linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club (webmention)
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@gRegorLove Join us for Homebrew Website Club next Wednesday! http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2014-09-10-homebrew-website-club https://www.facebook.com/events/372303256256372/ cc @pitchdesign @marihuertas @dentonjacobs (twitter.com/_/status/507978933329854464)
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neuro` kylewm: sure, I'll publish something about it when it's ready. Trickier than expected as I'm trying to make a really minimal install therefore compiling every dependency statically
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barnabywalters Kevinmarks: if Andrew has a personal site and can log in to the wiki he’s a creator
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Loqi barnabywalters: KevinMarks_ left you a message 1 day ago: looks's like shrewdness's elasticsearch instance died - getting port 9200 error
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barnabywalters the apprentice/creator *language* is retained as it’s useful, but the separate lists have been merged
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barnabywalters great to hear he’ll be joining us!
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barnabywalters Kevinmarks_: thanks for letting me know about the ES error, not sure what happened but I turned it back on
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KevinMarks_ yes, he's logged in
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neuro` tantek_: ask the channel for?
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KevinMarks_ he's gor a Known-hosted personal site
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jonnybarnes barnabywalters: noticed your getting https set-up, what finally spurred you on?
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barnabywalters jonnybarnes: tantek’s reaction to adactio and I admitting that our sites weren’t secured :)
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aaronpk lol what was his reaction?
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jonnybarnes talking of https, can we update the indiewebcamp page's cert sometime aaronpk? see https://shaaaaaaaaaaaaa.com/check/indiewebcamp.com
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barnabywalters aaron: he freaked out a bit :)
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@calum_ryan On route to sun, sea and @IndieWebCampUK (twitter.com/_/status/507986163739930624)
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barnabywalters argh, aaronpk ^^^ (no tabcomplete in the web UI)
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@danlyke @misswimp yeah, I wanna meet more North Bay folk, but am likely to learn more new cool stuff hangin' at IndieWeb. (twitter.com/_/status/507986216512258048)
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aaronpk jonnybarnes: shoot. yeah, I can update that.
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jonnybarnes excellent :)
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jonnybarnes aaronpk: remember the sha-r intermediaries ;)
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jonnybarnes s/sha-r/sha-2
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Loqi jonnybarnes meant to say: aaronpk: remember the sha-2 intermediaries ;)
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@kevinmarks don't worry, this is not what #indiewebcamp is like http://known.kevinmarks.com/comic/404271f4a1640db9e7fcdb87573da4a7/dont-worry-this-is-not-what-indiewebcamp-is-like- (twitter.com/_/status/507987904690278400)
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barnabywalters jonnybarnes: wat
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aaronpk barnabywalters: are you already in brighton?
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GWG Is there an agenda for tomorrow up already?
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neuro` Do you plan to broadcast some sessions like you did last year?
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barnabywalters aaronpk: yup, been here for dConstruct
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ben_thatmustbeme hmm, just need someone to respond on twitter so I know if backfeed is working
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gRegor` Link, ben_thatmustbeme?
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snarfed ben_thatmustbeme: done! feel free to nudge it by clicking the Poll Now button
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tantek_1 hello again from Brighton
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ben_thatmustbeme gRegor` https://twitter.com/dissolve333 just started POSSE to twitter
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jonnybarnes barnabywalters: what?
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snarfed ben_thatmustbeme: wms sent! https://www.brid.gy/twitter/dissolve333#responses
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ben_thatmustbeme wow for some time i have not been processing webmentions. the cron job was removed when my hosted changed the server I was on.
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jeckman Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately?) it looks like IndieWebCamp Cambridge 2014 is the same weekend as BarCamp Boston
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jeckman http://www.barcampboston.org/ and http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/Cambridge
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jeckman maybe a chance to engage some barcamp folks in indiewebcamp conversations?
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@kevinmarks @annwitbrock well, there is indiewebcamp UK in brighton tomorrow: http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK (twitter.com/_/status/507994881675907072)
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gRegor` Twitter favorite deployed, ben_thatmustbeme
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ben_thatmustbeme thanks, i have plenty to work with, finding errors in my webmentions code now
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@annwitbrock RT @kevinmarks: @annwitbrock well, there is indiewebcamp UK in brighton tomorrow: http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK (twitter.com/_/status/507996371220041728)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/comment/twitter/kevinmarks/507994881675907072/507995906474381312 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK (webmention)
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Loqi [mention] https://brid-gy.appspot.com/repost/twitter/kevinmarks/507994881675907072/507996371220041728 linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/UK (webmention)
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ben_thatmustbeme excellent, it worked
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@jeckman @t #IndieWebCamp in Cambridge is same weekend as #BarCampBoston 9 - potential oppty? http://www.barcampboston.org/ and http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/Cambridge (twitter.com/_/status/507997220613136384)
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ben_thatmustbeme cron job fixed now too (i hope) so it should be good
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ben_thatmustbeme sweet, even replying to twitter comments works fine
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KevinMarks_ interesting - comments as friend tagging http://www.buzzfeed.com/hillaryreinsberg/does-the-internet-still-need-comments-yes-but-a-different-ki
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KartikPrabhu KevinMarks_ errgh, I wouldn't want anyone commenting on my post just to say "hey @dude check this out?"
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KevinMarks_ well, it's an instagram/fb pattern
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aaronpk i've seen it done, been tagged in things like that, and tagged other people that way.
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KevinMarks_ twitter makes it a separate post with pointers
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aaronpk speaking of sha1... http://googleonlinesecurity.blogspot.com/2014/09/gradually-sunsetting-sha-1.html
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gRegor` I like Buzzfeed's placeholder for missing Flash support: http://s3-ak.buzzfed.com/static/images/mobile/unavail_mobile.jpg?v=201409051514
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gRegor` Re: tagging friends, I sorta did that the other day because it involved kylewm and snarfed, but I don't have multiple in-reply-to set up yet. So I just added a link to snarfed in the note as a cc
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snarfed yup. works for people who accept homepage mentions (ie wm messages), but that's not many yet
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KevinMarks_ o/
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snarfed http://indiewebcamp.com/indieweb-messaging
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gRegor` \o
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ben_thatmustbeme woah, that wasn't what I really expected to happen... btmb.me/s/o
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ben_thatmustbeme it pulled the thread all the way back to the first post. cool, but still unexpected
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snarfed ben_thatmustbeme: yup. intentional, and took some work. twitter does *not* make it easy to traverse full reply chains.
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ben_thatmustbeme i can imagine. very cool
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snarfed (specifically, there's no way to get the replies for a given tweet! i mean, wtf twitter, really)
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ben_thatmustbeme snarfed++
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Loqi snarfed has 44 karma
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ben_thatmustbeme wow, really?!
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snarfed nope
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ben_thatmustbeme that is pretty silly
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snarfed people have asked for it forever, and still no. :( https://dev.twitter.com/discussions/10056
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KevinMarks_ no-one has posted any sessions or demos for IWC UK?
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aaronpk who can I throw money at to make coffee appear for IWC UK tomorrow?
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gRegor` will accept money thrown at him for coffee, just in general :)
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techlifeweb snarfed: with bridgy, to favorite a tweet, do I create a post on my site containing <a class='u-like u-like-of' href='URL_of_a_tweet_I_want_to_favorite'>
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snarfed techlifeweb: yup! you actually only need u-like-of, but yes. https://www.brid.gy/about#like
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snarfed aaronpk: surprisingly hard to give money away, eh?
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techlifeweb snarfed: thanks.I think the indieweb Press This bookmarklet puts both in there.
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aaronpk snarfed: lol yeah I just haven't heard anything from anyone who is organizing IWC
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snarfed aaronpk: makes you hope someone is
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aaronpk ...yeah
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KevinMarks_ they're probably in the pub
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bret are email addresses urls?
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snarfed well they don't have a scheme
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KevinMarks_ mailto:
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snarfed KevinMarks_: heh, yes. but plain email addresses don't include that :P
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snarfed bret: someone talked here a while back about their project to interpret email addrs as urls, by abusing the user:passwd basic auth part of the url and omitting passwd
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snarfed forgot the project name
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KevinMarks_ yikes
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aaronpk http://aaron@parecki.com is totally a URL
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snarfed aaronpk: exactly! once you add http://, sure
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KevinMarks_ safari says "possible phishing site"
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kylewm bigblue something
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snarfed bret: why do you ask?
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kylewm http://userinfo.me/
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KevinMarks_ i think assuming mailto: before an email address-shaped thing is fine, notwithstanding acct:
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aaronpk weird! "The address for the website you're visiting contains a username or password"
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aaronpk chrome doesn't send the username when I visit that way
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aaronpk neither does safari
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aaronpk but curl does
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snarfed kylewm++
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Loqi kylewm has 46 karma
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bret snarfed: i need to parse incoming email addresses. looking for a python lib that does some validation and returns the local and domain parts as parameters
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kylewm dives into a pool of karma like scrooge mcduck
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bret so far I can only find validation. I guess thats enough to write a weak regex and not have to worry about edge cases
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tantek tries to catch up on logs
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KevinMarks_ aaronpk wants to send you money fro coffee, tantek
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tantek I think Clearleft already has the equipment and materials to make coffee in house
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tantek but perhaps for breakfast fruit / snacks?
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aaronpk that's fine
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aaronpk I haven't been able to actually get a hold of anyone organizing
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tantek Jeremy mentioned that Clearleft has a paypal account apparently
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tantek aaronpk - oh, besides me I guess ;)
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tantek though it's just me, Jeremy, Tom
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aaronpk so yeah I can send some money your way or to clearleft. I just don't have much ability to actually purchase things from here
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KevinMarks_ tantek: Also, my son Andrew is coming to IWC Brighton - he has a known site but is not a dev, so is generation 3
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tantek KevinMarks_: will be great to have him!
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tantek so… was he able to sign into the wiki with his Known site?
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tantek aaronpk - makes sense
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KevinMarks_ yes, though currently you have to use the Solo theme, as the others don't put the rel-me links on the homepage
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KevinMarks_ Also, I did the wiki edit for him, as templates are a bit hard as a first edit
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tantek copy and paste and change things?
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KevinMarks_ and learn URL syntax and so on.
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gregorlove.com edited /WordPress (+3) "/* Criticism */ closing <span>" (view diff)
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KevinMarks_ he's hoping to use a Known-based site for his theatre group and colleagues, so has a practical project in mind, and I think he'll get a lot of ideas from you all
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gregorlove.com edited /WordPress (+346) "/* Fatal Error memory exhausted */ Pages can not have numeric slugs" (view diff)
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@briansuda returns home after a long day @dconstruct, tomorrow @indiewebcamp and more interesting discussions. (twitter.com/_/status/508031163207020544)
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snarfed ben_thatmustbeme: saw your bridgy publish error on posting a tweet w/a picture. looking
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KevinMarks_ early indieweb tool: https://github.com/aaronsw/metamake
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ben_thatmustbeme haha, snarfed I was about to ask. I didn't post when it should have from webmention, so I went into fixing up the markup a little and tried from the url box on the site
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ben_thatmustbeme i've been getting a few errors saying it couldn't find my user on twitter. I'm guessing twitter was messing with something
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gregorlove.com created /slug (+288) "stub" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com edited /permalinks (+11) "/* See also */" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com edited /slug (+17) "/* See Also */" (view diff)
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techlifeweb.com edited /WordPress (+135) "/* POSSE */" (view diff)
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@Mindmapk Why can't you comment on this post? #indieweb http://werd.io/2014/why-cant-you-comment-on-this-post-indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/508036934011469824)
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snarfed ben_thatmustbeme: filed https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/279
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snarfed ben_thatmustbeme: i'll look tonight. if bridgy posts that tweet of yours once the bug is fixed, will you mind?
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ben_thatmustbeme not at all
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snarfed ben_thatmustbeme: thx
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ben_thatmustbeme thank you
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KevinMarks_ so how would you @ mention someone indieweb style? you can do it by including their home URL and it being webmentioned, but that is a bit odd
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aaronpk why is that odd?
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KevinMarks_ and on my site would add a note to the front page
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aaronpk I basically do that right now, but using my local nicknames cache instead of typing peoples full domains
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KevinMarks_ It is how we used to do it in blogs, true
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KevinMarks_ and technorati would give you a feed of them
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KevinMarks_ so maybe it's the lack of a reader that makes it odd
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KevinMarks_ putting them at the bottom, like http://www.kevinmarks.com/ is a bit odd
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aaronpk you've seen how I do it, right? http://aaronparecki.com/mentions
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aaronpk if you mention my home page it'll show up there too
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KevinMarks_ I mean like http://www.kevinmarks.com/#webmentions
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aaronpk sure, but there's no reason you have to show home page mentions on your home page
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KevinMarks_ right
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KevinMarks_ I could make a page just fot them and still use webmention heroku app