#indiewebcamp 2013-12-06

2013-12-06 UTC
#
aaronpk ok this may be the tipping point for me to finally get a DB backend for p3k for better indexing/searching
#
snarfed they include info on webmention HTTP requests and responses, original post links discovered, etc
#
tantek aaronpk: re: "augment the reply on your site with a syndication link" you mean augment the *comment* on your site with a syndication link right?
#
aaronpk comment yes
#
tantek needs to split those definitions!
#
tantek that would be really interesting
#
snarfed barnabywalters has the honor of finding my first bug: i don't handle relative webmention endpoints. https://www.brid.gy/log?start_time=1386287755&key=aglzfmJyaWQtZ3lyNAsSB0NvbW1lbnQiJ3RhZzp0d2l0dGVyLmNvbSwyMDEzOjQwODQyMTQ5MTMzNjY3OTQyNAw
#
tantek I mean, when you receive webmentions of replies to your posts you could go get their rel-syndication links directly from the reply permalinks
#
aaronpk oh right
#
aaronpk so, no new information gathered?
#
barnabywalters I always store syndication links for any external post taproot archives
#
tantek aaronpk - or rather, when you get the webmention for the twitter copy, you can find that you already have it!
#
barnabywalters it’s very useful e.g. for showing tweet actions or determining whether or not POSSE replies can be made
#
aaronpk oh I guess I already have that too since I store the full HTML and parsed JSON of external pages
#
tantek barnabywalters - sure I store those too
#
aaronpk speaking of which... that folder's gotta be getting huge by now
#
tantek but we're talking about storing the rel-syndication urls for *comments* from *other people* on *your posts*.
#
aaronpk 160mb, yeah
#
barnabywalters tantek: yep, that happens too. I don’t do anything with them yet
#
tantek I don't know if there is anything to do with them
#
tantek from a display/UI perspective
#
tantek but using a webmention backfeed proxy like this gives sufficient reason to store them
#
barnabywalters goodnight all!
#
Loqi goodnight!
#
snarfed night!
#
tantek.com edited /projects (+147) "/* Other Experimental Projects */ Bridgy" (view diff)
fritzy joined the channel
#
tantek snarfed - does Bridgy backfeed likes/favorites also? or only comments?
#
snarfed not yet, but they're on the roadmap
#
aaronpk oohh plz do likes/favs!
#
snarfed yessir :P
#
snarfed please point me to any examples in the wild of sites that handle webmentions for favorites
#
aaronpk sandeep.io
#
snarfed i've seen fewer of those than for replies
#
snarfed ah, thanks!
#
aaronpk werd.io too I think?
#
snarfed oh, if idno does than even better
#
aaronpk hm maybe not
#
aaronpk he *sends* liks tho
#
tantek.com created /Bridgy (+654) "stub" (view diff)
#
tantek snarfed also werd.io
_6a68 joined the channel
#
tantek oh I thought he did show them?
#
snarfed thanks for the stub!
#
tantek snarfed I took the liberty: http://indiewebcamp.com/Bridgy - feel free to expand :)
#
snarfed will do
#
tantek took your explanation and expanded just a bit
#
aaronpk super excited about Bridgy! a great example of a service that supports all the indieweb ideals
#
aaronpk no reason to rebuild that code into everyone's sites!
#
tantek aaronpk - well, usual spofs and such
#
tantek especially if one of those silos gets pissed
#
tantek a spof is easier to block
#
snarfed thanks aaronpk!
#
tantek but yes - I'm very excited about this too
#
snarfed tantek: agreed. that's exactly what happened to me with http://twitter-atom.appspot.com/, and why it now asks users to use their own app ids :/
#
tantek we can certainly use Bridgy to postpone building this code into our own sites
#
snarfed we'll see
#
tantek and perhaps postpone it so long that eventually we don't need to because of silo turnover?
#
snarfed hah, maybe. that's a long horizon
#
snarfed i'm all for some sites to do this themselves too though. not feeling too territorial. the more backfeeding, the better!
#
tantek realizes he has an iOS app for compositing images and could have done that rather than stitch images with markup
fritzy joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /short-domains (+164) "/* domains */ add .gy and Brid.gy use" (view diff)
#
snarfed thanks. i have to admit, i'm a little embarrassed at the cutesy domain
#
tantek snarfed - any other .gy domains you have?
#
snarfed but i had it already, and it fit, so meh
#
snarfed nah that's it
#
tantek ok I figure we might as well keep track
#
tantek it's quite catchy :)
#
snarfed definitely!
#
snarfed btw all (aaronpk tantek barnabywalters KartikPrabhu), please don't advertise bridgy too widely just yet, i'd like to let it soak for a few days and fix more bugs before announcing more loudly
#
snarfed thanks!
#
tantek ok no problem - wasn't going to do anything more
#
tantek just thought it looked real enough to deserve its own wiki page
#
snarfed oh no worries, the wiki page is great!
#
KartikPrabhu snarfed: sure thing. btw very cool tool you have built. will investigate more when I've done my physics paper for tomorrow!
#
snarfed i was thinking blog posts, tweets, etc
#
snarfed thanks!
#
bret wow how cool!
#
tantek snarfed - please feel free to add more warnings and such on the wiki page :)
#
snarfed sure
#
tantek so anyone that stumbles upon it is warned accordingly (however you feel appropriate)
#
snarfed thanks. for now, i'm good with the red "use with caution" language on the site itself
#
snarfed i'll remove that in maybe a week
#
tantek hmm seems all my iOS apps for photo composition only support square save proportions :(
#
snarfed heh, everyone loves squares and circles these days
#
tantek seriously
#
tantek btw re: http://wiki.akosma.com/IPhone_URL_Schemes - if given the choice of an app specific scheme and a link to a mobile website equivalent - I think I'm going to prefer the latter
#
tantek e.g. I will put a link to https://mobile.twitter.com/t/messages on my comm icon for "Twitter DM" rather a twitter:// URL
caseorganic joined the channel
#
snarfed oh definitely. especially since you'd have to detect user agent to really do the intent-style URLs right
snarfed, caseorganic, alaricmoore and tpinto joined the channel
#
snarfed !tell barnabywalters hey, just to check, looks like you revoked bridgy on the twitter side? totally ok if you did, and my fault for not allowing deleting yet, but i just wanted to check, since my code is getting auth errors.
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
lukebrooker, fritzy, tantek and skinny joined the channel
#
acegiak ok i've added some contact links to my page
#
bret wooo!
#
bret log into the wiki now
dentonjacobs joined the channel
#
acegiak oh yeah i keep forgetting to add those things to the wiki
dentonjacobs and bnvk joined the channel
#
peat ls
#
peat sighs.
#
snarfed lol. i know how you feel, peat
#
peat I think that means it's time to leave work and find something to eat.
#
tantek !tell snarfed thanks for additional protocols documentation links - added to post: http://tantek.com/2013/338/b1/people-focused-mobile-communication-experience#mob-comm-2013-12-05
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /Falcon (+351) "/* Contact expanded */ note fixes to labels I'd apply to make them consistent" (view diff)
tpinto joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /Falcon (+149) "/* mobile home template header icons folders */ wrap mockups in grey borders to better indicate grouping into single prototype images" (view diff)
snarfed joined the channel
#
Loqi snarfed: tantek left you a message 30 minutes ago: thanks for additional protocols documentation links - added to post: http://tantek.com/2013/338/b1/people-focused-mobile-communication-experience#mob-comm-2013-12-05
#
snarfed tantek: glad to help!
skinny and alaricmoore joined the channel
#
skinny waves mornin'
#
tantek hey skinnny
#
tantek we're having good times rethinking personal mobile website UIs :)
#
tantek skinny: blog post for context: http://tantek.com/2013/338/b1/people-focused-mobile-communication-experience
#
skinny tantek: i like it. do people get notification badges? like so? http://cl.ly/image/3L2u3o2Q1F3Y/Untitled-2.png
#
tantek good question and yeah I asked that question when we were brainstorming - because it depends on a *website* being able to push a badge notification to a mobile device.
#
tantek I think it's coming in iOS - I don't have the URL offhand
#
skinny i think the whole thing will fall apart if there isn't a way to see when you have a message from that person
#
tantek well let's find that out then ;)
#
tantek I think there's sufficient benefit in just making this work for your personal mobile website that it has legs regardless
#
tantek and I'm excited by the potential of how this could work in FirefoxOS with newer WebAPI support (WebRTC, Push notifications etc.)
#
skinny yah, for sure.
#
skinny what does one do who has two sites? personandplace.com and crystalbeasley.com?
#
skinny is this intended to include a rss feed of blog posts? or just 1 to 1 comms?
#
tantek skinny what does one do who has two IMs? two emails? two phone numbers?
#
tantek skinny - here's a mockup of the direction I'm going: http://indiewebcamp.com/Falcon#mobile_home_template_header_icons_folders
#
tantek needs to post that to his Dribbble.
#
tantek scroll down to see what happens when you tap the "Contact" icon folder
#
skinny wow that's some nascar
#
tantek it's basically a more usable re-organization of my "Elsewhere" section in my sidebar, with direct comm/message options tossed in
#
skinny yah, i got that.
#
skinny whether it's more usable is still up for testing ;)
#
tantek skinny - every iPhone home screen is ALL NASCAR
#
tantek so this is a focused subset
#
skinny i know right. i love that this moves away from that
#
skinny LOVE
#
tantek plus we hide the app options behind people instead of vice versa
#
skinny the ux team had a brainstorm for features of fxos. I said it should leave me the eff alone.
#
tantek what should leave you alone?
#
skinny in better words, it should support a peaceful brain, not jangle me out of concentration every time there's a notification
#
tantek YES!
#
skinny basically, exactly what you said in your post
#
tantek I've been stewing on that for a while
#
tantek and finally with the person-face-icon-home-page idea it clicked
#
skinny have you looked into the windows phone experiments in this direction?
#
tantek I realize my viewpoint is likely heretical with all the app-store centric perspectives.
#
skinny they have you set fave people on your home screen
#
tantek I heard they've made some progress
#
skinny how does this extend to things like shopping lists and evernote and such like that have little or no social aspect
#
tantek I think there's something different happening when we split that across both parties
#
tantek so that the callee has the choice of showing which comm channels they're ok with *right now*
#
tantek just focusing on solving messaging / message interruptions with this
#
tantek this doesn't address/effect mobile "tool" apps like Maps, Transit, Running, Shazam, Weather
#
tantek those still make sense as direct icons on your launch/home screen
#
skinny agreed. just a thing to acknowledge when we write about it. it's not either/or. you can have apps and people.
#
tantek yes. this is specifically for mobile comms
#
tantek hence the post title ;)
#
skinny yah. it's just that your screenshot shows only people, no mapping or browser, etc.
#
tantek skinny - yeah - actually completely reorganized my iPod home screen(s) Sunday night while writing this post. Took about an hour to think through and do.
#
tantek first screen is all "urgent access" tools. As mentioned. Camera, Music, Flying etc.
#
tantek second screen is people
#
tantek but that's another blog post
#
tantek and also why I only showed home screen screenshot fragments
#
tantek rather than a "complete" home screen
fritzy joined the channel
#
tantek aaronpk: about Checkie crashing on launch and thus why NOT to sync iOS apps with iCloud: http://tantek.com/2013/339/b1/why-not-sync-ios-icloud-ability-revert-updates
snarfed, tpinto, ryana and thatryana joined the channel
#
skinny problem is, you can't turn off notifications entirely for things like mail. you can prevent push, but the red badge will still show up.
#
skinny would be nice to be able to say "when peter send me a message via any channel, make my phone make a noise" instead of "when anyone from twitter send me a dm, make a noise."
ryana joined the channel
#
tantek skinny indeed. I want to turn off the red badge on Settings and App Store and I can't :(
#
tantek skinny yes! person-specific notifications
#
tantek ironically my Blackberry did that
#
skinny i want a noise customized to person, not channel. No matter how Peter sends me a message, make it chirp like a cricket. When Kat, make a meow.
#
Loqi gives skinny a noise customized to person
#
tantek well done Loqi, well done.
#
snarfed i have to admit, i now appreciate that my android phone doesn't do unread badges
#
Loqi yeah!
#
skinny what happened with loqi? i'm confused
#
snarfed (not trying to start a platform debate, honest)
#
skinny how are you seeing the notification shade play into this?
#
tantek Loqi sometimes responds to things people say in funny ways.
#
skinny i want a chocolate glazed donut
#
Loqi gives skinny a chocolate glazed donut
#
skinny hahah
#
tantek :D
#
tantek snarfed - I like that there's a diversity of platforms and approaches that we can compare and learn from.
#
snarfed definitely!
#
snarfed including ff os and others, even historical ones, not just the two party system :P
sparverius, jschweinsberg, fritzy, npdoty and thatryana joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /icon (+10) "/* Android browser comparisons */ add version info for Kevin Marks's screenshot" (view diff)
ryana, abrereton, fritzy and kylewm joined the channel
#
kylewm Evening all, I asked this last night but it was right before a meetup started, so I'm not sure if anyone saw :) Are any indiewebbers actively syndicating to status.net or pump.io (or any other decentralized service)?
melvster and cweiske joined the channel
#
tantek isn't decentralized service an oxymoron?
andreypopp and realzies joined the channel
#
tantek looks like there are a few folks POSSEing to App.net: http://indiewebcamp.com/app.net#POSSE_to_ADN
#
cweiske you can be a single person offering a service
#
kylewm hmm, I guess I shouldn't have said "service" ...
#
cweiske that's as decentralized as a service can get
#
cweiske local services
#
neuro` Can be blog comments considered as a service then?
#
cweiske yes
#
tantek how does that help?
#
tantek kylewm the pump.io stub is pretty small - not sure if anyone here is using it: http://indiewebcamp.com/pump.io
#
kylewm yeah, I'd be surprised about Pump I/O, it doesn't seem like too many people are using it in general. I was more hopeful about SN sicne there are a couple of mentions of it on the wiki
#
tantek.com edited /projects (+20) "/* StatusNet */ main" (view diff)
#
kylewm http://indiewebcamp.com/PubSubHubbub for ex
#
kylewm I was kinda hoping there'd be some automatic magic way to publish there :)
#
kylewm but it is seeming like no
#
kylewm also here http://indiewebcamp.com/How_to_set_up_your_realtime_feed
#
tantek.com edited /projects (+74) "/* Indie Web Projects */ evan.status.net is no longer online - says being converted to pump.io" (view diff)
#
tantek.com created /StatusNet (+460) "start a stub since a few articles already link here" (view diff)
#
tantek.com created /statusnet (+23) "r" (view diff)
#
tantek.com created /Statusnet (+23) "r" (view diff)
#
tantek kylewm - there was never a need to syndicate to Status.net
#
tantek users on Status.net were able to directly subscribe to *external* sites in realtime if they supported PuSH
#
tantek Federation as it were
#
tantek the only reason to POSSE to a service is if a) you have friends on that service (otherwise you're just spamming), and b) that service only allows people to subscribe to local-to-the-service accounts.
#
tantek in the case of Status.net, b) was not true.
#
kylewm ah ok that is exactly where i was confused
#
tantek Status.net was ahead of its time (still kind of is)
#
kylewm i have not figured out how to subscribe to an external site, maybe that feature has gone away?
#
tantek http://status.net/wiki/Remote_subscriptions
#
kylewm that is only if the other site is explicitly running statusnet software though, no?
#
tantek that should work with my URL for example, http://tantek.com/ since I have both an Atom ActivityStream and PuSH support for it (both discoverable)
#
tantek no
#
tantek that's the genius of it
#
tantek it only required that the other site support Atom with at least ActivityStreams object type markup, and PuSH
#
tantek which of course statusnet software supported
#
tantek so yes, you could subscribe from one statusnet server to another
#
tantek but because it just used building block standards
#
tantek it worked with *any* site that supported those building blocks
#
kylewm OK so I have a statusnet instance running on http://status.kylewm.com
#
tantek so go to your profile page there and click "subscribe"
#
kylewm :/
#
tantek ?
#
kylewm I don't have a subscribe link
#
kylewm if I go to... http://old.quitter.se/johnnynull
#
kylewm there is a subscribe link for me to subscribe to him
#
kylewm (quitter being another instance of statusnet)
#
tantek is there a +Remote button?
#
tantek per http://status.net/wiki/Federation
ryana joined the channel
#
tantek ah, my old identi.ca/t account is gone since it got transitioned from statusnet to pump
#
tantek so I can't check the UI there
#
tantek anyway, kylewm - there should be a Remote Subscribe button or option somewhere in the UI - hunt for it
#
tantek and it gives you a text box for the URL of the remote site
#
kylewm thanks tantek
#
tantek into that text box put a URL of a site that supports AtomAS + PuSH
#
tantek e.g. my site does so you try http://tantek.com/
#
tantek *can try
#
kylewm I will keep hunting
shaners joined the channel
#
shaners reads logs
#
tantek kylewm for example here's a statunet user (and site) that reposted one of my notes: https://status.ssweeny.net/notice/304641
#
tantek ouch - with the pumpio transition looks like all the old *.status.net links broke :(
#
kylewm wow, that's cool
#
kylewm yeah...
#
kylewm *.status.net is just transitioning over like this week
#
kylewm it sounds like they have been down for quite some time
#
tantek all of evanpro's reposts of my notes are only still around as POSSE copies on Twitter: https://twitter.com/search?q=%40tantekcom%20%40evanpro%20evan.status.net&src=typd&f=realtime
#
tantek note how when he reposted notes from tantek.com, and then syndicated those reposts to Twitter, it converted the reference to tantek.com to @tantekcom
#
tantek that was not a real account on Twitter until I went and created it so that it would link to *something* on Twitter :)
#
kylewm ha!
#
tantek per https://twitter.com/tantekcom/status/14190824867
#
@tantekcom brought into existence by @evanpro's tweet (and @mlinksva's RT) http://twitter.com/evanpro/status/14175166808
#
tantek yes this was long before we figured out all the POSSE details (or even had come up with the term)
#
tantek kylewm - perhaps you could capture some of this discussion / information on the StatusNet wiki page for future reference? http://indiewebcamp.com/StatusNet
#
kylewm You know, ever since I started following @t on twitter, it is recommending that I follow all the other @[a-z]'s
#
tantek even as just a bunch of examples / FAQs
#
tantek (that's pretty funny)
#
kylewm I'll be happy to add to the wiki page if I can figure out exactly what is or isn't supported at this point
#
kylewm thanks for your help :) i'm going to sign off, have a good night!
#
tantek even just capturing questions like that would be helpful!
#
Loqi night night
#
tantek night!
#
kylewm re: capturing questions, gotcha, good point, will do
ryana, LauraJ, KevinMarks, brianjesse, eschnou, eschenal and Jihaisse joined the channel
#
Jihaisse Hello
ryana and thatryana joined the channel
#
Loqi [mention] http://jeena.net/people-first linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/ (pingback)
fritzy joined the channel
#
Jeena Oh Loqi already got this, nice, I hoped that this pingback would show up on Tanteks post too, not sure if it would need to be a webmention or something.
#
Loqi :)
pfefferle, bnvk, realzies, natwelch, pavelz_, LauraJ, ryana, glennjones, abrereton, icco, fritzy, jonnybarnes, friedcell, tpinto, benatkin and npdoty joined the channel
#
jonnybarnes ah poo, I want to use markdown on my notes, but if I start a note with a hashtag the whole note turns into a title :(
eschnou joined the channel
#
jonnybarnes I suppose I could do straight swap on the note changing <h1>, </h1> to <p>, </p>
#
cweiske escape it? with rst, you can \ escape characters
#
cweiske no idea with markdown
eschenal, igalic and lukecyca joined the channel
#
jonnybarnes escaping works, porperly. I wasnt expecting that.
abrereton, andreypopp, ryana and barnabywalters joined the channel
#
Loqi barnabywalters: snarfed left you a message 8 hours, 59 minutes ago: hey, just to check, looks like you revoked bridgy on the twitter side? totally ok if you did, and my fault for not allowing deleting yet, but i just wanted to check, since my code is getting auth errors.
#
barnabywalters !tell snarfed RE revoking bridgy keys, yep I did — been wanting to try the “revoke keys” thing for a while :) will totally sign up again when I’ve implemented POSSE copy de-duping
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
friedcell, fritzy, glennjones, ryana, srushe, KartikPrabhu, andreypopp, igalic, abrereton1, KevinMarks, eschnou, eschenal, Acidnerd, pfefferle and dentonjacobs joined the channel
#
@transmatapp Just had a look at https://tent.io/ a protocol for decentralized social networking. Hope it develops on, looks interesting #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/408922185336901632)
#
@transmatapp @pfefferle @indiewebcamp Looks interesting how do I install it, just use the zip from github or do I need to package it in someway ? (twitter.com/_/status/408922185420791808)
#
@transmatapp For #indiewebcamp (@ Urban Airship w/ 4 others) http:///login?continue=%2Fglennjones%2Fcheckin%2F4e061abfb0fbba5eee137388 (twitter.com/_/status/408922185320108032)
dentonjacobs, ryana, eschnou, KartikPrabhu and eschenal joined the channel
#
@pfefferle @transmatapp what exactly do you mean? @indiewebcamp (twitter.com/_/status/408931440768741377)
ryana joined the channel
#
@glennjones @pfefferle @indiewebcamp sorry playing with twitter archive extractor code and managed to pipe 200 old tweets into the steam of @transmatapp (twitter.com/_/status/408932736519663616)
fritzy and yatil2k joined the channel
#
yatil2k Hi there! Is there a github repository for the indieauth.com website? I have identified an accessibility problem in the sample HTML code and would like to contribute if possible.
#
pfefferle yatil2k https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth
andreypopp and ryana joined the channel
#
yatil2k Thanks pfefferle, I filed those two pull requests: https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth/pull/41 & https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth/pull/42
#
@yatil @pfefferle Danke! #indieauth (twitter.com/_/status/408939972444827648)
glennjones joined the channel
#
pfefferle yatil2k gern geschehen ;)
#
@pfefferle @yatil gerne gerne :) #indieauth (twitter.com/_/status/408941185944649729)
ryana joined the channel
#
Jeena oh yatil2k is Eric Eggert? didn't see you here yet and I was confused to see german words told by Loqi :D
#
yatil2k Yep, it’s me :-D
#
Jeena nice, the internet is a small village :-p
fritzy, LauraJ, skinny, glennjones, ryana, acegiak and scor joined the channel
#
acegiak pfefferle: what are you currently using for your blog? are you using the semantic linkbacks plugin? I'm trying to work out if there's stuff I need to do on it further
jonnybarnes and ryana joined the channel
#
jonnybarnes barnabywalters: I like your site redesign
#
barnabywalters jonnybarnes: thanks! still a work in progress, as ever, but I’m much happier with the new version, both styling and code
#
jonnybarnes is it standard for profile pics to be located at /photo.jpg ?
#
barnabywalters jonnybarnes: no, in general using well-known URLs for things like that instead of discoverable rel values is a bad design pattern
#
jonnybarnes so as long as I use the right rel tags I can host it wherever?
#
barnabywalters jonnybarnes: yep, that’s the idea
fritzy joined the channel
#
jonnybarnes barnabywalters: hang on, you have posts that are tagged, without any tags in the post: http://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/4TPEjw/
#
jonnybarnes whaaaa?
#
barnabywalters no *hash* tags, but there are some other tags, either manually or automatically added
#
barnabywalters see also my posting UI: http://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/new
#
barnabywalters I use hashtags as visual, textual gestures, then the tags box is basically a rapid prototyping and experimentation area
#
barnabywalters also a command line — e.g. notes tagged with 'notweet' aren’t POSSEd, but I don’t want that showing up as a hashtag
#
barnabywalters then if I find I use these little tag patterns often enough I solidify them into proper, more easily discoverable UI controls
#
barnabywalters also I cheat and automatically add tags, e.g. reply for replies, quote if the content contains a <blockquote>
#
barnabywalters in that case tags are being used to experiment with new post types without having to write any new code
#
barnabywalters but they’re still useful, e.g. http://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/?tagged=reply or http://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/?tagged=bookmark
#
jonnybarnes thats pretty cool
#
jonnybarnes just reading about marking up my notes
#
jonnybarnes I'm upto here http://indiewebify.me/validate-h-entry/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fjonnybarnes.net%2Fnote%2F2
#
jonnybarnes is the fact its on jonnybarnes.net not pretty telling of who the author is?
#
barnabywalters jonnybarnes: looking good! you should mark up the published datetime using the <time> element with an ISO8601 datetime so it can be parsed
#
jonnybarnes also I'm thinking of putting class=p-category" straight on the tag itself?
#
barnabywalters e.g. <time class="dt-published" datetime="2013-12-02 10:00">2 days ago</time>
#
barnabywalters jonnybarnes: yep that should work
#
jonnybarnes let me read the Carbon spec, currently using its W3C time method
#
barnabywalters yep, Carbon::toW3CDate() or whatever the method is should work
#
barnabywalters but the attribute needs to be datetime not time :)
#
barnabywalters RE authorship, in an ideal indieweb world yes we could assume that domain.com/note was authored by domain.com — in practise that is not true
#
barnabywalters but you don’t have to put a full h-card on your note pages if you don’t want to — a simple rel=author link back to your homepage is fine
#
barnabywalters see also http://indiewebcamp.com/authorship
#
barnabywalters (although indiewebify.me doesn’t detect that correctly yet)
#
jonnybarnes time is sorted now, I think
#
barnabywalters jonnybarnes: yep, looking good now
#
barnabywalters oh, you should add an explicit p-name on the same element as e-content, so reader applications can easily tell whether or not to show the name as well as the content
#
barnabywalters e.g. for articles it makes sense to show both, not so for notes
#
pfefferle barnabywalters i think i used the right author markup on my site but indiewebfy.me doesn't recognize it: http://indiewebify.me/validate-h-entry/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnotizblog.org%2F2013%2F09%2F16%2Findieauth-unterstuetzt-openid-delegation%2F
#
pfefferle acegiak there is still a lot to do!
#
barnabywalters pfefferle: hm yep that’s a bug on my end
#
barnabywalters thanks for the tip-off!
#
pfefferle ufff... thought that i released a mis-formatted version of sempress once again
#
pfefferle acegiak http://indiewebcamp.com/in-reply-to#algorithm
bnvk, glennjones and xtof joined the channel
#
barnabywalters pfefferle: my instance of indiewebify now parses correctly, I’ll get bnvk to update the main one http://indiewebify.waterpigs.co.uk/validate-h-entry/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnotizblog.org%2F2013%2F08%2F15%2Fopen-app-net%2F
#
pfefferle nice thanks
KevinMarks joined the channel
#
jonnybarnes how is it determined that a page is a post permalink page? no.3 on here: http://indiewebcamp.com/authorship
#
barnabywalters oh good point — that’s not defined
fritzy joined the channel
#
jonnybarnes you mean in general, or just on the wiki?
#
barnabywalters I think if there’s no h-entry on the page then the authorship algorithm just tells you who authored whatever *is* on the page rather than trying to figure out *what* it is
#
acegiak pfefferle: oh cool thanks that gives me something to work off
#
pfefferle :)
#
acegiak hitting the sack atm, will have a go in the morning
KartikPrabhu and snarfed joined the channel
#
Loqi snarfed: barnabywalters left you a message 5 hours, 26 minutes ago: RE revoking bridgy keys, yep I did — been wanting to try the “revoke keys” thing for a while :) will totally sign up again when I’ve implemented POSSE copy de-duping
#
acegiak pfefferle: i also put a widget area in the top of my sempressp so i could add contact links like tantek's suggestion
#
acegiak acegiak.machinespirit.net
#
pfefferle you can also use built in hooks
#
acegiak for the header area?
#
acegiak oh as in i should make a child theme that isnt horribly broken, yes. yiu are right
#
pfefferle add_action('loop_start', '...');
#
pfefferle that should load the content before the post renders
#
acegiak yeah
#
acegiak so much to do
#
acegiak ok ACTUALLY sleeping now
#
acegiak nght
#
pfefferle good night :)
#
Loqi don't let the bed bugs bite
#
jonnybarnes acegiak: you know your homepage says you were born in '98 right?
#
jonnybarnes how does twitter handle unicode? when a twet is limited to 140 chars, is that actual chars, or bytes?
#
jonnybarnes https://dev.twitter.com/docs/counting-characters answers this
ryana joined the channel
#
jonnybarnes woah, you can combine a diacritical mark with the space character?
bnvk, tantek, friedcell and ryana joined the channel
#
tantek good morning #indiewebcamp!
#
tantek I've been getting and (remembering) examples of folks doing clever contact-like things on their personal site home pages
#
tantek e.g. Scott has simple phone and email text links on his home page: http://scottbullard.com/ with a more link that gives you hexagonal icons! http://scottbullard.com/more.html
#
tantek.com edited /Template:indieauth-status (+25) "Twitter appears to be down for indieauth" (view diff)
#
tantek barnabywalters - yay for putting a stream on your home page!
#
tantek looking forward to seeing a composite stream
#
tantek more personal home page contact coolness - check out the live IM status on Jared's hCard: http://www.jaredhanson.net/
#
tantek and subtle use of a map as background - yet also location - it's centered on his current location (pretty sure) http://npdoty.name/
#
barnabywalters tantek: unsure about how to implement a composite stream — might try how tommorris does with expandable articles
#
barnabywalters also not sure how music fits in a composite stream, and whether or not I want it to
#
barnabywalters so I’ll start with something like your “last three articles”
#
barnabywalters tantek: maybe you should make a new section on http://indiewebcamp.com/homepage with these examples
snarfed joined the channel
#
tantek barnabywalters - since I come from the old school of blogging when we used to put our full blog posts on our home page, for me it was a matter of figuring out how to add notes ;)
adactio joined the channel
#
tantek barnabywalters - nice page!
#
tantek I don't think I've seen it before
#
tantek barnabywalters - yes I'm finding that even I am using my "last 3 blog posts" section to quickly reference what I've blogged about
#
tantek recently
#
barnabywalters these damned notes are so pushy :)
ryana joined the channel
#
barnabywalters especially with replies in the mix too
#
adactio So Chloe documented her journey to POSSEing tweets: http://chloeweil.com/blog/hipster
#
tantek.com edited /homepage (+393) "add articles and see also icon" (view diff)
#
tantek barnabywalters - yes I'm mixed about including replies on my home page stream. I do included them now, but I also like how on Twitter it hides @-replies on someone's profile page by default (unless you follow them I think?)
#
barnabywalters tantek: that (hiding replies if they’re directed at someone the reader doesn’t follow) is the responsibility of the client IMO
#
tantek I also need to update my replies to properly use a different post type since I have a shortcode letter reserved for them "r" (also for reviews - basically any posts that are a *response* to *something* or a *regarding* something in particular - e.g. bookmark posts would be "r" for me)
#
tantek barnabywalters - sure - that's one approach
#
tantek however I prefer to optimize for a higher signal to noise experience by default, even for new visitors
#
tantek perhaps especially for new visitors
#
tantek adactio - yeah!
glennjones joined the channel
#
tantek she's come a long way from when you brought her as your apprentice to indiewebcamp 2011!
snarfed joined the channel
#
adactio :-)
#
tantek (so proud)
#
barnabywalters that’s a good article
#
barnabywalters interesting that she decided flat files wouldn’t scale well
#
tantek barnabywalters - been using flatfiles for "storage" (ie not just static files) since 2010. so far so good ;)
#
barnabywalters my CSV-based index is working snappily with >2000 notes
hober and realzies joined the channel
#
tantek that is a well hyperlinked post (Chloe's)
#
tantek yes, great article
#
jonnybarnes Is her middle name seriously Wolverina?
brixen joined the channel
#
tantek looks for the h-card (or hCard) markup
ryana, fritzy, friedcell, melvster, eschenal, eschnou and CheckDavid joined the channel
#
tantek also, from Microsoft (of all places), some people-focused mobile UI thoughts: http://www.windowsphone.com/en-US/how-to/wp8/people/people-hub
#
tantek key difference I'm envisioning with the indieweb approach: a *split* of the people-focused UI between the user and who they're looking to contact.
#
tantek Putting the callee/messagee in control of preferred methods of contact, comm-channel-availability, and whitelisting who can contact them how. Much more "peer *and* peer" rather than just a self/device-centric approach.
andreypopp and brianjesse joined the channel
#
tantek.com created /Template:icon (+39) "let's try something" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /Template:icon (+13) "padding" (view diff)
realzies, thatryana, b0bg0d_ and bnvk joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /icon (+1285) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ add Chloe, inline icons for people, see mostly faces" (view diff)
snarfed, squeakytoy and KevinMarks joined the channel
#
tantek.com edited /homepage (+435) "add interesting IndieWeb Examples" (view diff)
#
tantek.com edited /POSSE (+283) "add Chloe's post about implementing POSSE to a new Articles section" (view diff)
#
tantek barnabywalters - added to homepage page as you suggested
#
tantek !tell barnabywalters - added to homepage page as you suggested
#
Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
ryana, brian___ and thatryana joined the channel
#
snarfed apologies for the humblebrag, but i have to admit…
#
snarfed is enjoying watching siloed comments and replies stream onto his site automatically: http://snarfed.org/2013-12-06_new-app-engine-logo#comments
#
snarfed (the old bridgy had been doing the same backfeed for a while, but the new one is much nicer. among other things, the commenters' pictures show up!)
glennjones joined the channel
#
tantek snarfed - well done! great example of backfeed in action.
#
tantek especially love the permalinks to the original comments
#
snarfed thanks! now to nudge you into automating webmentions on tantek.com so you can use it too :P
#
tantek (though I would have linked the datetime to the original - odd to create a second permalink for someone else's comment)
#
tantek (yeah seriously)
#
snarfed yeah, it made it take longer, but i'm glad i did the little polish stuff.
#
tantek it really shows
#
tantek I think UX polish is essential for the indieweb
#
snarfed agreed, the second wordpress permalink is weird, but kinda reasonable. it's a general drawback with posseing and pesosing, there are multiple copies of things, even beyond what we expect with normal webmention replies
#
tantek UX polish is one of the big reasons FB, Twitter etc. crushed "feed readers" and other previous attempts
#
snarfed definitely! it's important across the board, which includes us
#
snarfed hopefully i can eventually get a more frontend/UX person interested in bridgy
#
tantek yes - and I hope we as a community and continue to emphasize UX as one our distinguishing aspects compared to previous / other open source / protocols efforts
#
tantek (BTW re: implementing on tantek.com: keep getting distracted by other things - my latest mockup for the icon / comm mobile personal web UI: http://indiewebcamp.com/Falcon#mobile_home_template_header_icons_folders - scroll to see how "Contact" expands)
#
snarfed oh man, so cool
#
tantek this feels doable with some CSS (and maybe just a tiny bit of JS)
eschenal and eschnou joined the channel
#
tantek yeah I'm hoping it feels super seamless when accessed via mobile browser. we'll see :)
#
snarfed ignore me, ignore webmentions, at least for now. keep pushing on that stuff!
#
snarfed re CSS, definitely
#
tantek I want it to look and feel beautiful to really showcase what is possible with open personal web based design / interaction.
#
tantek ok - off for a quick run but I wanted to show you those screenshot mockups first to at least share my thinking while I'm building.
#
snarfed good call, thanks
#
snarfed enjoy!
josephboyle joined the channel
#
snarfed for anyone reading this later, the backfeed is from http://brid.gy/ . feel free to try it out!
brianjesse, bnvk, tantek, tantek_, KartikPrabhu, amz3, ryana, bnvk_, npdoty, KevinMarks and alaricmoore joined the channel
#
aaronpk snarfed: here's a fun one for you... what to do with hackernews/reeddit comments on a post?
#
aaronpk for example: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6825353 (original URL: http://werd.io/2013/gendered-pronouns-in-software-a-quick-primer)
benatkin, brianjesse and tantek joined the channel
#
snarfed reads logs for context
#
snarfed aaronpk, not sure what you mean
#
snarfed i'm guessing you don't mean you'd like to implement backfeed for comments on reddit or hackernews…?
#
snarfed if so, it's hopefully straightforward for anyone who knows python to add a new silo to bridgy
#
snarfed pull requests encouraged!
tantek and jschweinsberg joined the channel
#
tommorris tantek: I now have a 'People' folder on my iPhone homescreen. :)
#
acegiak morning all
#
acegiak josephboyle: my homepage has my DOB wrong and atheist spelt wrong
#
acegiak born 1988
#
tantek tommorris - awesome!
#
tantek also reads logs
#
tantek aaronpk - do you really think backfeeding hackernews/reddit comments to your own site would improve the signal to noise or experience?
#
snarfed tantek: you're probably right, but i can see a few different motivations for backfeeding, and improving signal to noise is maybe just one
#
snarfed e.g. capturing/centralizing the discussion is another, if you care more about that than curating each comment for quality
#
snarfed i love that about webmention, that it decouples capturing and archiving from deciding whether/how to display back to users
#
tantek that's a good point
#
tantek might be useful just for archiving
#
tantek maybe viewing in a personal dashboard
#
tantek instead of having to actually go visit those sites
jonnybarnes, scor, fritzy and npdoty joined the channel